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Can Pickup and Seduction Have a Higher Purpose than Just Hedonism?

Alek Rolstad's picture

seduction higher purpose
If you could no longer pick up chicks and put your dick in them, would you have a reason to live? Well, that happened to me (for two weeks), and here’s what I discovered.

Hey guys, and welcome back. Last week I discussed hedonism as it relates to pickup and seduction.

Here's a link to that article if you haven't had a chance to read it yet:

Pickup and seduction are often seen as a hedonistic activity (which I do not disagree with) since they focus on the short-term and superficial pursuit of pleasure. Hedonism is often seen as the desire to acquire initial satisfaction with a lack of long-term satisfaction.

Some criticize hedonism when considering these points.

In my previous article, we discussed whether this hedonistic aspect of seduction was harmful and whether it was morally wrong. We concluded that it was not wrong if you considered it a hobby or a leisure activity.

Everyone in well-functioning societies has incorporated hedonistic activities into their daily lives. It could be drinking with friends, eating unhealthy food occasionally, going bowling, playing pool, or something else.

We separate work and leisure. We work hard, then get some time off to enjoy fun spare-time activities. We need to see pickup and seduction as just that, and there is nothing wrong with that.

But some have been into this for a long time, and others get so obsessed that it becomes central to their identity. Some see pickup and seduction as a lifestyle choice. If this sounds like you, this post is for you.

Learning Seduction: 7 Words of Wisdom for the Slow Mechanical Learner

Varoon Rajah's picture

By: Varoon Rajah

learn pickup seduction
Do you feel like learning seduction is taking too long and failure comes too often? You might be a mechanical learner like me. If so, here’s what you should know.

The learning curve with women, pickup, and seduction isn’t smooth for every guy.

Some start learning, have a few wins, then quit forever once they’ve found a good (or good enough) girl. Others start early in life and get good quickly with concentrated effort. Others start later and also get good fast.

Still others are naturals who have some experience when they begin learning game methods. There are even those who are so fascinated with game that they dissect it thoroughly, immerse themselves, and even surpass their woman goals!

This article is geared for the mechanical learner that Chase talks about in his article on the Three Sorts of Lady Killers. The mechanical learner is defined as a slow but deliberate learner. He’s the guy who puts forth a constant effort and succeeds when he doesn’t quit, facing mountains of failures, rejections, and setbacks to his methods before he finally figures it out, moving on to his next sticking point.

You might see this person make 1,000 approaches and only succeed with 1, yet he’ll keep going. Maybe three years later, you’ll see him as a master in his approaches, but now he’s stuck at the texting phase, and trying to get girls out on dates. A few years later, he’ll have mastered that, and now he repeatedly fails at escalation and last-minute resistance (LMR) at home.

The mechanic is quite rare, but that doesn't mean his methodology is inferior. He continually makes mistakes at the beginning of learning any skill, and by sheer practice and willpower, working through failures, he perfects his style. He uses his previous failures as models for facilitating success in the new model.

Many will not relate to this article. I want to be clear that in no way is this system any kind of limiting belief. It’s simply a different process of learning. If you’re this type of person, you will quickly realize as you’re reading the archetypes that this is you. And if you’re not this person, it’s unlikely you’ll relate.

Is It Moral to Be a Hedonist?

Alek Rolstad's picture

By: Alek Rolstad

is hedonism moral
Many guys who learn pickup and seduction struggle with the morality of living a hedonistic lifestyle. This is a legitimate dilemma, so let’s get philosophical.

Hey guys. Welcome back. Today I will take a step away from the technical posts and share more of a reflection.

Over the years, I've seen that the philosophy of picking up women and seduction is closely related to hedonism. Both defenders and critics have used the hedonist argument to both praise and criticize pickup.

Pickup is viewed as hedonistic because the element of pleasure, or more importantly, short-term sensual pleasure is central. Some, including our own Hector Castillo, have presented some solid analysis on the main blog and the forum.

I would like to give you my take on the subject. Honestly, I doubt my opinion will differ much from Hector’s, but I may add some different perspectives.

Some questions we will try to answer are:

Whether or not you agree with my points is irrelevant. The purpose of this post is to offer another perspective that may help you evaluate your values and perhaps even challenge your ethical system so that you may come out stronger.

How to Win at Seduction: Maximize Strengths and Minimize Weaknesses

Tony Depp's picture

seduction success
Not all men are born lady killers. Lucky for us, the seduction community has proven time and again that even YOU can get hot girls by focusing on what you can control.

Because most guys haven’t had success "just being themselves," they think verbal game is the only essential skill in seduction. There’s no possibility that a girl may be waiting to meet a guy who looks like you, right? You’re not good looking, or tall, or rich. There’s zero chance that she may be single, bored, lonely, or horny, and you’re just her type at the right time and place?

It’s the men who don’t try often enough who are the first to cry “Only looks matter!” They have inner-game issues related to their self-image (e.g., I’m ugly). So, I get them to record audio of their approaches with their phones, and unsurprisingly, their conversations are boring: no emotion, no insights, just surface level small talk. Then they wonder why they’re getting phone numbers, but not dates. It must be because they’re so ugly, they figure.

I also get these eccentric guys. They show up dressed like bums, or clowns, with nose hairs jutting out, loose, dirty clothing, or fashion from 1996 hip hop culture. They never run out of things to say, and their conversations are anything but boring. They also believe they’re the most handsome of all men. They have astronomical self-esteem. But the women don’t want anything to do with them because they feel embarrassed being seen with these guys.

So as a coach, I quickly slot men into categories:

And so forth.

Every man can improve himself. But he has to believe it’s possible and be willing to put in the effort.

seduction success

As far as these low-self-esteem cases, the one thing they have in common is that they’re “not enough.” They’re just not good enough (in their minds) to get the hot girls. They’re not good-looking enough, and they just don’t know what to say. They think if they could correct one of those issues, then everything would turn around for them.

That’s what they tell themselves, anyway. If they were better looking and had game, everything would work out. Well, isn’t that why we’re learning this stuff? Because we’re not all born handsome and witty?

It’s how I used to think, too: I wasn’t good enough for hot girls. I was too short, too fat, too skinny, too young, too old, too plain, and I had to talk myself attractive. Once I discovered the pickup community, it was like being handed a magic wand. All I had to do was practice these tactics and techniques, so I’d finally know exactly what to say to girls. Now, almost 14 years later, I still have no idea what to say to girls to get them to like me. But I’m a lot more confident, and women like that trait.

Here’s the truth about “Game.” As a science, it was made for average, frustrated chumps. Not good-looking, social geniuses.

We’ve learned:

Pickup vs. Seduction: Is There a Difference? (Yes!)

Chase Amante's picture

By: Chase Amante

pickup vs. seduction
Pickup: the art of finding a girl to take home. Seduction: the art of influencing her mind, to create desire and other urges. How do the two relate… and which is better?

On Tuesday I talked about succeeding with closed or 'impossible' girls... inspired by a tussle over the subject we had on the Boards.

There's another nuance I want to discuss before we wrap this subject up though. That is the distinction between pickup and seduction.

While related -- and while the two terms are often used interchangeably (including by me) -- they are in fact different.

Knowing what the difference between the two terms is will aid your thinking about both... as well as your ability to use each area in the most effective way.

Do You Only “Think” She’s Out of Your League?

Tony Depp's picture

she's out of my league
Why do you think she’s out of your league? Is it because she really is, or is it because you’ve put her there for no good reason?

Most guys who immerse themselves in pickup theory are looking to date up, not down. They want the women they’ve fantasized about, and they won't settle for less.

That’s why I got into this stuff. I was so incredibly insecure that just talking to a pretty girl would trigger a panic attack. Then if I found the guts to approach a girl (I rarely did), I’d stutter, sweat, and say ridiculous things that made no sense.

I could stare longingly at the beautiful girls, but I had no clue how to capture their attention. And besides, they were out of my league. These girls didn’t hook up with guys like me. They went out with the popular, outgoing guys, not the introverts.

 

Transformation

So as I neared my 30s and really delved into this seduction stuff, it all made sense. It wasn’t that I wasn’t good-looking enough, too short, or too low on the social ladder. I just didn’t understand the women’s point of view. I had no grasp of psychology — theirs or my own.

I spent years reading, watching videos, going out day and night to parties, social events, and did cold approaching at the mall just so I could look into a beautiful girl’s eyes in a way she’d know that I’m used to women like her. It’s no big deal. She’s safe with me.

Where men are primarily attracted to looks, women have much different attraction mechanisms. If you understand female psychology, you can use this to date women you might have considered out of your league.

You Must Fix Your 'Inner Game' (by Doing External Things)

Chase Amante's picture

By: Chase Amante

inner game
"Inner game" is the way you play the game on the inside. Good inner game is crucial – but the way to improve yours is not alone in a room in front of the mirror.

I had a call earlier with our director / casting director Casandra, who is always an absolute joy to talk to. Casandra was pivotal to the filming of my 'get the girl in one date' program One Date & The Dating Artisan, as well as a few other programs we're set to release in the next couple months (including my long-delayed course on personal charisma and a bachelor lifestyle, and another on touch).

On our call we discussed a new project we want to do for this lockdown situation. While we were on it, Casandra told me a rather incredible story of her own about guys she'd encountered who still had a lot of 'inner game' work to do.

The coaching I want to do is one where, rather than have a student on with a coach, then send him out between sessions to practice in the real world with women (which many guys can't do now due to the lockdown), we instead have him alternate between coaching sessions and video 'date' sessions with beautiful girls we've trained to go on these practice dates with guys so they can do what they've covered with the coach despite the lockdown.

Casandra liked the idea and we are at present setting that up (it's still going to be a week or two before I'll be able to tell you more... but if you're interested, you can fill out this form; we'll be in touch as soon as we can say more about it).

Anyway... as we talked about this, Casandra told me a story of her own, that related to the kind of thing we discussed.

A while back, she'd worked with another date coach, named Leo. Leo was helping a group of U.K. students who were 'below beginner' in romantic experience. They had very little experience with women, although Casandra said they were all "nice people, not weird or bad, they all looked normal, some were even handsome."

Leo decided to put these guys into one-on-one interactions with beautiful women to acclimate them to women like that. Casandra recruited the girls, and also joined herself.

Then came go-time. When the students started talking to the women normally, just in a normal person-to-person interaction, everything was fine.

But then, Leo told each student to imagine that he had approached his girl, that she liked him, and now he was talking to her. After Leo told the guys this, Casandra cocked her head a bit and smiled at the guy she was paired up with. Just a very cute, warm little smile (she showed me this smile. Totally harmless smile).

And her guy started crying.

A number of the guys started crying.

The moment they were asked to imagine these were girls they'd approached, they just lost it, and started bawling.

Casandra said she was shocked at the response. And honestly, while I have been in this business for 12 years, I was also a little surprised to hear this. Probably because many of the guys we get on GC are not total hard case beginners... many of them are guys who have a little dating success under their belts already and just want to up their results.

And I will say -- even when I was totally socially isolated myself (in my teens), I still had beautiful girls flirting with me or pursuing me (because I did other stuff to seem cool and attract women in). So I always felt 'entitled' to hot women.

Hearing about guys crying when faced with beautiful women they were told to imagine they'd approached got me thinking about this whole 'broken inner game' thing.

Because certainly, if a guy is starting out in a place like that, his inner game needs work.

Do You Feel Anxious Around Women? Don’t Let Them See It

Varoon Rajah's picture

anxiety is a turn-off
Women are attracted to confidence, and anxiety is the opposite of confidence. So if women don’t find anxiety sexy, but it’s a normal feeling, what can we do about it?

Having recently lost a lover because of anxious thoughts, I figured it would be useful to cover how to address anxiety with women and dating.

While anxiety is a normal human emotion, some people feel it more than others. It’s a terrible weakness to display around a woman and is the opposite emotion from a “turn-on” and sexual excitement.

Think back to your most memorable sexual experiences, if you’ve had some. Was anxiety present? Would anxiety have helped the experience? If yes, did the anxiety make the situation better?

Most likely, your best experiences around women involve no anxiety at all. But if you’ve had experiences that did include anxiety, and I’ve had many, I can attest that these moments become question marks in women’s eyes.

Anxiety, especially if it shows up at critical moments like the first kiss or the first escalation, can ruin your chances to get a woman and keep seeing her.

Men will often experience anxiety and nervousness in critical moments during a seduction:

On the journey of getting better with women, men must train themselves to never feel anxiety around women, particularly in the critical moments mentioned above. As a rule, it’s best to avoid showing any anxiety around a woman you want to be sexual with.

10 Things to Do During Your Coronavirus Quarantine

Tony Depp's picture

coronavirus quarantine things to do
 

This weekend, Chase posted an article titled "Can You Still Meet People During Coronavirus?" The article is jam packed with great statistics and details about what to expect in the coming weeks and months, and how your dating life could be impacted by the COVID-19 pandemic. Depending on your local quarantine situation (or whether you've chosen to self-quarantine), the answer to the title question can feel pretty bleak.

You could be facing weeks of strict social distancing or complete isolation. If so, after you've sorted out your good-citizen strategy to slow the spread of the virus, you may suddenly realize a greater need to tend to your sanity.

We may not be accustomed to our new (albeit temporary) way of life, but that's no reason to let ourselves stagnate by just waiting things out. In fact, a global pandemic is a great excuse to have a quarantine vacation and focus on inner game and lifestyle work.

I define inner game as everything that makes you proud and happy to be you. So whatever you do that improves the quality of your life will increase your inner game.

Rather than obsessing over the constant stream of news about the coronavirus and resulting economic perils, we can use this time to improve the neglected areas of our lives, like health, wealth, and happiness.

Focus on what you can control. By doing so, you'll come out the other end of this thing more ripe, not rotten. So here are 10 things you can do to improve (or at least occupy) yourself during your coronavirus quarantine.

How to Stop Being a Simp: 10 Steps

Chase Amante's picture

how to stop being a simpSomehow, despite the existence of this website, and the half million to million people who read it every month, there are apparently more men desperate for female approval than ever in recorded history.

There is an outright simp epidemic.

Is there anything sadder than a man who swallows his pride, pedestalizes the feminine, and launches limp-wristed attacks against his fellow man in a feeble attempt to curry favor with women?

Truly, there is no man more tragic than the simp.

First, here is the SIMP TEST. Watch this video, and pay careful attention to your emotions:

SIMPING IS KING SHIT CONFIRMED pic.twitter.com/B7kF1f6wfN

— Ching (@Hotline_Ching) March 10, 2020

Did you experience a sort of cognitive dissonance, and a kind of revulsion that says, "Though this woman is young and attractive, I find her oddly and off-puttingly moronic, and I also think she is lying?"

Congratulations, you are not a simp. The rest of this article does not apply to you.

However, you may want to read it anyway to make especially sure to inoculate yourself against the dangers of simp-dom.

On the other hand, if, when watching that video, did you not experience any cognitive dissonance, and instead experienced a swelling of pride? Did you feel something along the lines of, "This beautiful woman recognizes me for my superior quality?"

If so, I regret to inform you you are a carrier of SIMP.

But don't fear.

There is a cure.

If you follow my 10-step method, we can restore your testosterone levels to normal, train you to prefer manly domination over effeminate obeisance, and make you a man women actually respect and desire to sleep with (perhaps even chase), rather than one they manipulate then giggle about as he conducts himself in embarrassing fashion on their behalfs.