Attraction is Either There, or It Isn't | Girls Chase

Attraction is Either There, or It Isn't

Chase Amante

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attraction is there or it isn't
Attraction is there at the beginning, or it never fully shows up to the same extent. What determines attraction – and why can’t you ‘create’ it?

This is going to be a weird article for some readers.

On the one hand, I’m going to challenge some basic assumptions you may have. But on the other hand, not really.

If you’ve read here a while, you’ve seen me comment that attraction is either there or it isn’t; you cannot ‘create’ or ‘build’ attraction. Though if you read enough of my articles, you can probably find instances of me using the phrase ‘create attraction’ or ‘build attraction’ to talk about something I’m suggesting you do. This article is about what, exactly, it is you cannot ‘create’ or ‘build’... and what other thing(s) you can build/create. Along the way, as we go, I hope you will discover some new ways of looking at attraction that lets you better use it in your courtships with women.

To get away from the confusion, in this article I will divide the thing we commonly call attraction into two (2) discrete daughter elements:

  • Fascination, and
  • Excitement

How these two play off each other throughout a courtship will be our focus today.

Chase AmanteAbout the Author: Chase Amante

Chase woke up one day in 2004 tired of being alone. So, he set to work and read every book he could find, studied every teacher he could meet, and talked to every girl he could talk to to figure out dating. After four years, scads of lays, and many great girlfriends (plus plenty of failures along the way), he launched this website. He will teach you everything he knows about girls in one single program in his One Date System.

GET CHASE’S ONE DATE SYSTEM

Comments

Uma's picture

Chase, from what you've seen and experienced, does race contribute to fascination?

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Uma-

Yes, absolutely. Race is a fundamental aspect of how you present; as such, it gets incorporated into women's assessments.

It's impact is variable by race and from girl to girl within a given race (and guy to guy; being X race has a bigger impact for a guy with poor fundamentals than it does for a guy with incredible ones).

Like all fundamentals, it plays a role with almost every girl, whether that role is positive or negative, and great or small.

Chase

stallion's picture

I always knew a fat bank account plays a factor in getting girls.I am more of an exciter. And I struggle to get top end girls which are the girls I really want. I can get any other girl especially black girls since I am black in the UK.But even thou they are at best (7-8s) not (8-10s). Hot white girls not much success in that arena.
I have good fundamentals,although I work out and wear nice form fitting clothes(but I wish I could get better ones) but I am still a student so no fancy car/job, I think all these limit me with the girls I want to get.(8-10s) across all races.
I have very good verbal game and I can approach any girl easily but like you said I am not getting anywhere with them.
But if you have noticed Chase,it is hard-work getting those fundamentals down and getting good at game at the same time..one always suffer for the other.
Do you recommend I take one year off working on my fundamentals like getting bigger muscly body, getting a good paying job, fattening up my bank account so i can afford fancy cars and clothes?100 percent dedication nonetheless. After which I can start my journey with the high-calibre girls I want.
But in the meantime it will be torture seeing that hot girl and not approaching her because my fundamentals are not there yet...it's so hard to restrain myself because it is one more hot girl i'm never going to know (in the sack).LOL
THANKS CHASE

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Stallion-

I commiserate! I can't say I'd recommend time off to work on fundamentals though. Fundamentals are only useful with girls insofar as they help you with girls. Often you will not know the impact until you improve them and use them.

e.g., when I had a fancy car, I thought this would help me with girls. Instead I discovered it made them more likely to put up lots of resistance and view me as a potential boyfriend. So I stopped letting them see my car usually.

Or when I got a great job with a prestigious, well-known company, I thought that would make girls fall all over me. So I went around flirting with girls, getting them into me, then telling them to call me and giving them my card, and I would never hear from any of them. Or I'd tell them where I worked and some would be interested but all would boyfriend zone me at best. Eventually I quit telling them about my prestigious, well-paying job and told them I was a writer or an actor and found this worked much better.

The biggest coup I had with fundamentals was when I grew sexy facial hair, which took all of a week, and combined that with my recent stylish haircut plus a new cool red jacket and white scarf. I experienced a huge boost in attraction, to essentially ridiculous levels. It was so night and day I couldn't believe it. I found myself going, "Wait, so my nice car and great job didn't work, but a chinstrap and soul patch plus a cool haircut and a few cool clothes did?" Had I not been approaching though, I doubt I'd have worked on these. And then I'd have been befuddled when I began approaching after a year and started to show off my Mercedes-Benz and hand girls my business card and have them be totally uninterested. "The year was wasted and none of it worked!" I imagine that'd be quite discouraging.

Instead, when you're approaching, as soon as a new thing becomes available you can try it out and get feedback on it right away: "I've got this cool car, I'll bet babes will love it!" Then you show it to them and they're all meh. So you say okay, bad theory; now let me try something else.

Chase

Jimbo's picture

The hottest girls are always attracted to rich dudes. Being or getting out of a fancy car is like chick crack. The hot girl's ideal (and I'm talking of the girl who consciously turns herself into a hot bimbo) is being turned into another shiny accessory of a guy who owns many other shiny things and a big house, where she can afford to just be pretty and worry about superficial things and make her man look good with a hot trophy in his arm.

Seriously I really don't know how you couldn't pull the easiest poon with an MC-Benz. Perhaps it attracted mostly the kind of girls that weren't your type and so you weren't really focused on them.

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Secret is "Is this something lots of other men use to compete for her with or not?"

If half the guys around her drive luxury cars, and you're relying on driving a luxury car to impress her, you won't get far.

When I was starting out, I had terrible fundamentals, but a prestigious job. However, I also lived in Washington, D.C., where men with terrible fundamentals + prestigious jobs are like deer in a Pennsylvania woodland. Even with the hottest girls, if you're meeting them in bars, they're being hit on by men with 6 and 7 figure jobs all night.

I bought my Benz in San Diego. Not as many men with professional careers and nice cars there (though there still were a good amount). However, also somewhat mismatched to the scene. Go to PB and the girls are most impressed by bad boys, guys with abs, surfers, guys with motorcycles, etc. The guy trying to show off a Benz there is kind of a tool. He doesn't get it. Go to North Park and the girls want punk guys, rebel guys, etc. Benz doesn't fit the environment there either; too establishment. Go to OB and the girls like scrubby hippie guys, weed smokers, etc. Again, doesn't fit the scene.

One place I did notice a few positive effects was picking up trashy / ghetto / lower-level gold digger / lower-level social climber girls in the Gaslamp District (downtown). These girls seemed to be impressed with my ride and I'd get a noticeable attraction boost. The higher level social climber girls would treat it as kind of an "of course he has a Benz, who doesn't" thing, however. No harm from it, but on the other hand it allowed them to immediately mark you as a guy competing on provider value, and unless you could demonstrate higher levels of wealth you were out of the running. You are better off with those girls being the throwaway rebel bad boy than you are being the moderately successful provider.

I'll see about doing an article on why specifically various wealth signals men employ often don't have the impact they'd hope they would. But the biggest reason is down to "these things aren't as hard to get or as rare as most guys would like to think they are." Another is "be careful about signalling you are a provider, just not a very good one (i.e., not top 2-3% of providers [she has access to])."

Chase

Jimbo's picture

But here's the thing Chase, all the other types you mentioned aren't that scarce either. You know why you see so many girls in Pacific Beach pairing up with bad boys, guys with abs, surfers, guys with motorcycles, etc? Because that's what the young guys over there do. Girls' tastes don't change from neighborhood to neighborhood, they all like the same things in guys (edgy and/or capable), and so they just go with whatever boys having those traits there are in that neck of the woods, and the average twentysomething Californian dude that has an interesting life smokes weed, surfs, works out, does punk, rides motorcycles, etc, and that's what the girls will date, and it'll seem that's what the girls want.

I think the reason you don't see many young girls with rich dudes is because most guys their age they're dating aren't rich. And even in the parts where there are many rich guys, I don't think their huge numbers would be a problem, because I'm pretty sure hipsters abound in some parts of San Diego, yet you'll still see many girls going for them, despite them not being a scarce commodity. Why? Because hipsters tend to look cool (for many girls), like they're into something cool or interesting, and it doesn't matter if there many of them, girls still like them. And I would posit it's the same for rich guys, or guys who own cool stuff.

You mentioned guys with motorcycles. Why do they like them? Because they look like they're living a cool life, doing interesting things, and they want a ride in that. Same for a guy with a sports car. We've all known the guy in high school with a car who attracted all the girls. A wealthier guy (and I'm not even talking filthy rich) tends to have a more interesting life, he can afford to go to more places, is more capable to do more fun things, and I think that's what the girls like, they want a part in his world. Now I'm not talking about the boring 9-to-5 guy, this one won't be interesting even if he has a solid bank account, at least not to the twentysomething girls, but the one who uses his money to do cool things, go to nice places, or even just has a nice house with a pool, I think most girls would be attracted to him. Because let's be honest, guys with a nice houses with pools and stuff are cool, most men would like to hang with them, and many girls want to be Mrs. Them, even for just a week or so.

I know you don't think attraction to wealth, resources, or to "the guys who owns stuff" is in-built in girls, if I remember correctly you said it's mostly their mothers who teach them that when they're young, and you believe that the women who do only do so when they're desperate to climb a ladder or get out of poverty (I think they only do those things with the weaker/naive niceguy guys or beta), but that's one of the few things I disagree with you on. I think they do, and that this attraction is a cousin to their attraction to authority, or "the guy who owns the place", they just feel an urge to become more submissive to him so that he may pretty please let them in for a ride or to stay.

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Jimbo-

Never said attraction to wealth/success wasn't in-built! I said prioritizing it above all else or almost all else wasn't in-built, and was instead a product of a girl's environment and/or upbringing.

Nuanced article on cars/jobs/apartment and when these help you get laid vs. when they can hurt you here:

Will a Nice Car and Good Job Get You Laid?

Chase

90210's picture

Chase,
I noticed that men in the age range 35 years old to 45 years old attract younger girls of 19-20 in a way that most guys my age ( I am 19 ) could ever dream of. Why is it that a sexy older man with excellent fundamentals win the younger girls?
I have tight fundamentals but it is hard to compete with these guys. Further, many of my female friends have repeatedly told me that the sexiest men they have met were in their late 30s or early 40s. They literally adore these older men.
My belief used to be that youth triumphs but from what I am seeing, it seems age coupled with top fundamentals rules. I would like to know why is it so and how can sexy younger guys compete with those men?

Ericj55921's picture

Ive also gotten jealous of older dudes especially when they claim that they were more masculine then, say at 33 than at 23.. like why cant one cheat huh? Lol thats what ive done ive just become more masculine to the point where women notice me, teenage girls and even older women notice me and are attracted to me as well, moreso than the average 25 or younger age range. I consider my masculinity and non verbal fundamentals as that attractive for my age. No need to be that old for me to be AS masculine and attractive AS a 30 year old. Sincerely believe I can compete with them , the older crowd

T's picture

I am 55 years old (ok, looking a few years younger good in shape but nevertheless an old man :-) ) and believe it or not I am also good with women in their twenties. I have a close friend who is 47 and he is also good with women of this category. We both have a good general education have studied and can very often relate to the womans profession and/or hobbies because we have known a lot of things on our way.
This site is really outstanding and I have a lot adopted and tried out. But when I should summerize the basics of attraction then I would say that women want men who are relaxed around them. No fear to make a mistake, strong frameset and most important in my opinion: outcome independent (NOT aimless.... quite the contrary). The same applies for my friend.
I don't care if the woman is 50 or 25. If I like her and she likes me the game is on. I can also sleep with an attractive 50 year old woman and believe me there are a lot of them you only must have an eye for it. So I come from a background of absolute abundance. My range is from 25 - 60 years so I can be relaxed and I am. I suppose that all older guys who are good with much younger women have more or less these or at least a part of these traits.

Author
Chase Amante's picture

T-

women want men who are relaxed around them

That's a great highlight, and it's one of the big things women get with older men they don't get with younger ones. Even the younger guys who are confident all tend to be a little on-edge and trying a little too hard with most girls. It's almost impossible to get around when you're younger; you just have to put up with it and fight through it until you're old enough to be more relaxed.

The other major advantage of attractive older men I've identified is a kind of Goldilocks level of firmness. You're not so rigid with women you're try-hard firm, like younger guys who are trying to be bad asses are; but you're not weak with women either. You're able to progress the courtship forward with a firm-but-relaxed hand without veering into pushy territory or, alternately, too-tentative territory. Hard for younger guys to get this right until they reach a certain point.

These changes seem to be a combination of life experience (more dating experience, more girlfriends, have been married, have raised children - who challenge every bit as much or more than women - have dealt with various sticky social problems at work, etc.) and life perspective (he no longer sees banging the hot blonde shaking her ass in the corner as the thing that will determine whether he is a man or isn't; she's just someone it'd be nice to sleep with, but if he doesn't get her, there'll be other girls... it's not life or death). Provided the guy's taken care of his health and appearance, and his other ducks are in a row, leaves him in a pretty good position to get women all across the age spectrum.

Chase

T's picture

Chase,

You wrote "You're not so rigid with women you're try-hard firm......but you're not weak with women either".
Absolutly. And I think this is the take home message behind the thinking of "cute and silly" that you always advice. And another fact that comes automatically (I have seen it also seen at my friend) is that you start more and more to test women yourself and they love it. I do it often simply for pleasure and the more attractive the woman the more I like it. You even can directly test back like so:

She: Are you flirting with me?
Me: That is already flirting for you? You aren't very demanding, are you? (with corresponding smile, voice tone and eye contact)

or

She: I dont like men who approach a married woman.
Me: Is that an expression of moral outrage or a regret that you never have been approached? (here again: sexy smile, voicetone, eyecontact)

I have a set of standard "backquestions" and these can sometimes even be combined with one another to cover a wide range of tests. For me it is fun, challenge and feelgood factor.........

Author
Chase Amante's picture

90210-

Check out these two articles; full skinny on the 'sexy older men doing great with younger women' phenomenon is here:

Chase

Jimbo's picture

You do get more composed, more deliberate, more assertive as you get older, that's because you've seen more things, you've gained more power, most likely have gotten more money, so fewer things impress you. You've also acquired more skills socially. All of that shows in the way you behave and come across, and girls find it sexy.

I'm in my late twenties and I notice a difference in my own demeanor from my early twenties; things that used to impress me then impress me less now, and I hesitate less to make a move on a girl because I see them more for what they are: humans who shit and fart and are self-conscious about two thousand things about their looks and personalities. And that's even truer of the younger girls, 19-year-olds are appearing so young and cute and clueless to me these days (some of them are hot though), and that automatically makes you feel superior to them and you behave accordingly (in a non-dickish way), and guess what they'll love it, they'll wanna be with that guy who knows so much and seen so much about the world (compared to them) even if all you did was go to college and attend a frat party EXCITEMENT = ON

So yeah, what I'd advise is go for younger girls. If you're 20, go for 17-year-olds or something. If you're in college and they're in high school for example, that'll up their fascination with you or excitement about you. In short, they'll look and feel more girly next to you, and that'll turn the both of you on. I think that's what it all comes down to.

Science says science does, listen to science9's picture

Saying that attraction happens in the first seconds that people meet is ridiculous!!! Sometimes your statements are exaggerated or even wrong. It is more accurate to say that say that attraction happens after a few conversations with someone.

And yes, you can create attraction with someone if that person has not seen you in a while. For example, if you were the biggest loser on earth and now look fit, is more educated, knows how to play a musical instrument, have a great job, dress great, cook great, have a great lifestyle and is much better than most of the men she knows.

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Saying that attraction happens in the first seconds that people meet is ridiculous!!! Sometimes your statements are exaggerated or even wrong. It is more accurate to say that say that attraction happens after a few conversations with someone.

Not according to the science:

Science Explains Instant Attraction

For each picture, the volunteers had a few seconds to rate, on a scale of 1 to 4, how much they would like to date that person.

...

Some 63 percent of the time, their initial, photograph-based interest in dating a person was backed up by their real decision after their five-minute speed date.

Chase

Tomas's picture

I have to reply here. Of course, several seconds looking at a photograph is not enough. My theory is that fascination happens very quickly based on look and feel and it is then confirmed or rejected based on first conversation, I think that might be 30 seconds in total....

However, the surprise. I kept track on my online dates. Some time after each date, I assessed whether the woman was attracted to me or not. And I was critical. It is about 70 per cent.
Chase says that in 63 per cent, the photograph-based interest was correct. I think that if the volunteers had had a chance of a small online chat with the persons on the pictures, that rate would be a little higher, maybe about 70%, which is also what I found (the methodology was different, I admit).
The backside of the coin is that 30%, the woman is just not attracted. And add the cases when you are not attracted to her. That's why online dating sucks :-)

Tom

Moon's picture

How about power / wealth / intelligence, is this included in the fascination? I mean for example, a girl just happen to meet but not fascinated by your fundamentals but once she finds out that you are a powerful politician, who gives speeches and excites crowds, she becomes "fascinated" at an instinctive/deep inside level.
The point I want to make is there might be some fundamentals that cause fascination, that a girl cannot grasp in the first 30sec.

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Moon-

That is a great question.

You know what, I do not know.

My instinct would be to group that emotion as something separate from raw woman-to-man fascination, if it's based on something learned, rather than an immediate click on first encounter.

e.g., if the multimillionaire goes dead broke and becomes a pariah in his industry, who is more likely to stick by him, the girl who immediately clicked with him the moment she saw him, before she even knew he was wealthy, or the girl who became intrigued by him after she learned of his wealth? Instinct suggests the former girl is far more likely to stick by, while the latter will lose her interest much faster. That would make me assume built attraction based on things she learns about you (like wealth or power) are based around excitement rather than fascination.

Chase

Neal's picture

In this case, if a woman were initially attracted to you, then it should be easy to win her back? (Not for cases where you cheated on her, but for cases where you didn't make the move fast enough, right?).

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Neal-

Theoretically, yes.

Fascination never goes away. So if you can resolve whatever problem drove her away, she should be inclined to come right back. Excitement, once gone, is usually more challenging to rebuild.

Chase

Sam2's picture

Chase,
Another great article. It responds beautifully to my concerns on how much I achieve with women thanks to fundamentals or game. You said it's 50-50, and I will keep that in mind, because many times I tend to count only on my fundamentals, which I religiously take care, and I get entitled because of them. I falsely think that because of my fundamentals women should just bombard me with lusty looks. So, you do a great job reminding me that it is massive action and game that must be added to fundamentals.

One question: Based on your experience, how often do you feel fascinated by the women who are fascinated with you? Even more, how often do you encounter your dream girl among the girls who are fascinated by you?

I am asking because I think most of the times the type of girl I attract by doing absolutely nothing (i.e. the type of girl fascinated with me) is FAR from my type of girls.

To make things worse, I noticed the following trend: ENEN with great fundamentals, most girls I attract by default or who throw approach invitations on me or who stare hard at me on the street are average or below average in looks.

Is there a way to "control" what you get through sheer fascination or are we sort of doomed to get what comes to our plate even when our fundamentals are in check?

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Sam-

Yes, very key! The best fundamentals in the world just make you look pretty and that's it, if you are not taking a lot of action. Need enough of both.

I'm not sure what determines what types of girls are fascinated with you and whether you get ones you're fascinated with as well. The girls who are fascinated with me are invariably either girls who fit my dream girl profile, or girls I am very attracted to regardless even if they aren't perfect dream girls for me. Only sometimes do I have girls shoot me lots of signals and have these be girls I'm entirely uninterested in. Usually if they're shooting me signals they are at least the type I will look at and say, "Hmm! That girl is really sexy...!" It's been this way pretty much since I hit puberty, so I can't say there's a specific thing I did or that determines it; it's simply always been that way for me.

I've heard from various guys over the years who report different things. Some are like me, and almost all girls who signal them are either their 'type', or at least girls they find attractive. Some are like you, and the only girls who signal them are girls they don't want. I've tried to figure out what causes the difference, but all I have at this point are theories and speculation. I don't much know. It's a weird thing.

My prime theory at the moment is attainability; guys who get the girls they want to signal them put out signals that they are less attainable to other girls, which intrigues their types of girls while it drives away other types. But I don't know for sure. There must be some nonverbal thing going on but I haven't observed enough of both types of guys in the field to figure out what it is.

Chase

Chand's picture

Thanks for clearing this up, Chase. A while back I took your reccomendation to read some of Aaron Sleazy's books, and they were great. They led me to find his blog where I found a very anti-game stance from him and his followers. His logic was simple and made a lot of sense. As you probably know, the gist of his approach is pretty much identify a girl giving you approach signals, open the girl, touch her, dont talk too much, take her home. I got the impression from his site that if you werent tall, white, rich, and famous with a big cock and GQ face that you would most likely not get the uber attractive girls and no ounce of game would help you. It made me doubt the teachings of Girlschase and RSD(the two sites that taught me so much about women) and for a while I wondered if it was even worth putting in effort to become a better flirt, conversationalist, etc. It also brought back my limiting beliefs which I haven't had for a while. After this article, I now realize that Sleazy just takes a pure raw attraction approach almost soley focused on fundamentals. This article helped clear some mental roadblocks I've had for the past few months and reassured me that game is still incredibly important and should be paired alongside with great fundamentals. Thanks again for the great article!

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Chand-

Yes, that's a great analysis!

Aaron is kind of the anti-Mystery. Mystery, if you know him, was the original big name pickup artist who pushed game as the end-all of doing well with girls. Everything was all about routine-based game, and if you just learned the routines (combined with some peacocking!), you could get any girl. The thing with Mystery was, that while he did have great routine-based game, he also had incredible fundamentals, and he did not teach this. He may not have been aware of how important that aspect was. And a lot of guys just listened to what he said and missed that part of what made him successful entirely.

Aaron on the other hand has (I hear from guys who know him) great fundamentals and also great game. But he doesn't teach the game, for the most part, and focuses on talking about fundamentals + venue/target selection, plus some amount of logistics handling. Alek spent a fair amount of time hanging out with Aaron some years back and has told me about some of Aaron's techniques and game... Great stuff. Guys often forget or ignore some parts of their approach that are important to their results. A lot of this stuff is unconscious. I've been watching our new product videos and I watch myself with the actresses and see myself do something and the girl reacts well to that and I'm like, "Oh yeah, I do that with girls, don't I? And they usually like that and respond well to it." But it's never anything I'd teach in a million years because it seems so trivial or not something I'd pay attention to normally.

Anyway, Aaron is a fantastic guy. Very smart guy. His stuff on logistics handling and target/venue selection is very, very good stuff.

Chase

Ninano's picture

Hey Chase, quick question relating to your article on persuasion techniques.
I'm in a debate competition and want to strengthen it using the techniques. First, do you use those in your writing?
If yes, how do you implement it? "Big, Concrete examples" seems pretty straight forward to use. How about implementing the 6 other in writing specifically? Or should I use them in my delivery style?

Second, I did not have the opportunity to comment on the article about Donald Trump but man I was impressed by your ability to analyze the given situation.I have heard nowhere of his persuasion techniques and I honestly thought Trump would lose.Seriously, you're analytical skills are amazing, I haven't met anyone who can deconstruct situations and understand the different dynamics. This is perhaps one of the many reasons your articles are so popular. This particular skill you have, I suspect it is almost second nature with so much experience but if you ever find some way to actually teach it, I'm your student. ;)
Cheers bro!

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Ninano-

Wonderful! Debating is an exceptional skill set to hone. Very much worth learning. Hope you do well.

Yes, I use all those Trumpian strategies (some more than others) in my writing. My contrariness is part of what's made the site successful; over the years I have systematically taken aim at sacred cows of all the various dating advice niches that I felt were misleading guys and knocked them down. Mainstream dating advice orthodoxy (e.g., the early boyfriend or move faster), pickup artist orthodoxy (e.g., reactions vs. results or the neg), manosphere (e.g., MGTOW or red pill).

Not that I want to bring these institutions down; just that I want to break dogma and get people to stop doing ineffective things (and do more effective ones instead!). But it's also quite useful from a marketing perspective; if you're saying the same thing as everyone else, it's not very memorable. If you're telling everyone to do the opposite of what the consensus has agreed is correct, however, everybody remembers you, and tells their friends to check you out, because this guy is crazy but he has a good point and it even kind of makes sense.

Defying negative labels I do a lot. I make sure it's impossible for any thoughtful person to label us a stereotypical [whatever they want to label us], mainly by removing the downsides of whatever we might be labeled as. e.g., mainstream dating advice usually stays away from specifics or telling guys how to get sex; we give both specifics and sex-specific advice, so can't label us an ineffective mainstream site. PUAs typically are only focused on notch count raising and open relationships / mLTRs; so we give tools to get more notches, but encourage guys not to make this their focus anymore than it needs to be, and have heaps on running awesome relationships of all strips, including monogamous LTRs. Manosphere sites tend to be sour on women and view them as selfish and manipulative; we spend lots of time detailing female psychology so men can get inside women's heads instead of stand on the outside and pass judgment. That's just a sample, but we do that on a lot of levels.

Congruency of course is paramount. Trait highlighting we use in many of our images, as well as in examples, though I don't usually give people nicknames. Sometimes I do - you'll see it in some articles, usually in humorous ways.

Defense, then attack you'll mostly only see me use in comment section battles. If you want to see that in action, I recommend either the comments under my "Girl Has a Boyfriend" article (first comment starts the debate, on whether it is moral or not to teach men how to sleep with other men's girlfriends) and Hector's "Girls Adore Homoerotic Men" article (comment thread on whether I am qualified to discuss anything other than seduction, using the commenter's progressive talking points as the wedge).

As for analysis... Practice makes perfect! It is, for me, a first order skill, something that takes top priority with me. I guess if you want somewhere to start, force yourself to get to full understanding of anything you encounter even if it seems at first Byzantine, and don't accept the extreme or expedient positions/explanations most people retreat to. Don't be afraid to say "I don't know" if you can't arrive at conclusions that incorporate all the evidence and still make sense, even if everyone else is saying "Of course the answer is X. How can you not see that it's X?" Always be skeptical of your own conclusions as well. Most people look for evidence that they are correct; you need to train yourself to search out evidence that disproves your conclusions, so you can revise both your conclusions and how you arrive at your conclusions as well.

One final tip I suppose is that nothing is absolute and logic is infinite; you must know this in debate, particularly if they're having you represent both sides. A skilled debater wins the debate no matter which side he's assigned to. Once you've had that experience ("I am always right, no matter which side of an issue I am on"), it's hard not to be skeptical of both your and others' conclusions.

Chase

Kaelos's picture

When you mention that, "You also cannot, in my experience, 'lose' attraction" do this mean that you cannot lose fascination?

What if you lose fundamentals due to laziness (getting fat, losing muscle tone, dressing sloppily, etc), will she lose her fascination for you (if she started with very high fascination for you)? If she can lose fascination for you, can you bring it back up or once it's gone it's gone?

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Kaelos-

The fascination never goes away. But excitement can for sure be tamped down.

If you get fat, lazy, and gross, her opinion of you is likely to morph into something along the lines of, "Man, what happened to Kaelos? He was perfect. But now he's so 'meh'. What happened to him? It's so sad." But if you bounce back, her attraction comes right back, because the fascination never went away, and now you're back.

(whereas say you hook up with a girl you only felt sexual excitement for after you'd had a few drinks and the night had worn on, and the next day you weren't that excited by her anymore. Then later you saw she'd gotten fat. Then later still you saw she'd slimmed down again. Unless you've been on a dry spell or she's being very friendly, you won't likely be terribly excited by the slimmed down her. Maybe just excited enough for a fresh shag for old time's sake, then back to not dating her again. She didn't fascinate you before, and that doesn't change now, although you may get that "Ooh, she's slimmed down, that means she's on the prowl" excitement boost, plus the "Hey, I banged this chick before and it was not bad... Might be nice to bang her again" excitement boost)

Chase

SZ's picture

1.So I was going through the age articles again and noticed the list on the first article with how men at certain ages do well with men if they're exceptional.

So I'm thinking, how can I be exceptional right now and for when I'm older? How can I just hurry up and be exceptional now and be exceptional forever.

So I'm not yet at the age where you say a man has to be exceptional as an older man, but I know younger guys can be exceptional too, I figured that it would make the process much easier to just be exceptional forever.

As a younger guy, what can I do to be exceptional to women right now? I'll list what I'm working on, so if there's more please tell me.

I'm working on getting really muscular; I'm addicted to the gym.

I'm working on making a lot more money than I ever had ever; I'll get a full-time and part-time job if I have to.

I'm working on my education with going full-time at school.

I'm working on my fighting with classes.

I'm working on girls by going out more and talking to more, even if I'm do it by myself.

Would that make me an exceptional young man?
What makes a younger man exceptional?
If I can do it now, I will.

Would buying designer brands and a fly car help or make me look too much like boyfriend material?
I still want to be fly.

2. I've been walking around to build up my fundamentals and to see how the women look and what not. Like the first days of the newbie assignment. I'm working on everything; I even try to give girls and girls that are working sexy eye contact and use my sexy voice. Think they can tell? Haha

Anyway, how many times should I walk around places I usually go to, like the mall or a cafe, before it looks like I'm there too much and might be trying to pick up girls? I actually do go to a lot of places that would be good for picking up, and I do go to a lot of these places with my chick.

3. How can I tell if my fundamentals are getting better? I can't really tell, do I just have to talk to more women or should I slow down more and walk more powerful? I don't want to over do it.

4. There's this comment I would read from time to time from you so long ago, I have been trying for months to find it recently, it gives me motivation. I think I asked the question or another user asked a question about being older, and you told me or the person that you thought they were like 70 or 80 Years old, and just laughed about it once you found out the age and said that that's not an old age at all.

Anyway I used to love to read that comment so much because it's like saying "you're never too old to succeed". I would be very appreciative if you can somehow find that comment for me.

Thanks for everything!

LIFE FEELS SO GOOD WHEN YOU TAKE IT BY THE HORNS!!!!!!

Author
Chase Amante's picture

SZ-

To be exceptional now:

The stuff you're working on sounds good. I do not see anything related to vibe on there, however. That should be a priority. "I'm nailing down my sexual vibe" "I'm really focused on my charisma" etc. Troubleshooting on vibe in this article:

Nice job on the early stages of the Newbie Assignment. How often you can walk around a place depends on its size and foot traffic. The bigger and busier, the more often you can circle back through. The smaller and quieter, the sooner it'll be obvious this guy comes here to hit on girls.

3. How can I tell if my fundamentals are getting better? I can't really tell, do I just have to talk to more women or should I slow down more and walk more powerful? I don't want to over do it.

When you get more approach invitations, that's a good sign.

When you get warmer and more excited receptions on approach than you used to get, that's a better sign.

When you face less resistance with women and higher compliance as you run your courtships, that's a still better sign.

When you start banging hotter girls, in higher volumes, faster, that's the best sign.

Anyway I used to love to read that comment so much because it's like saying "you're never too old to succeed". I would be very appreciative if you can somehow find that comment for me.

Sounds familiar, but I don't remember which article that's on. This DDG search might help:

https://duckduckgo.com/?q=site%3Agirlschase.com+70+or+80+years+old&t=ffab&ia=web

If you mess up with girls who were fascinated with you, the fascination will still be there, but it's likely buried under auto-rejection. You'll have to dig it back out. Girls in high school, if it was fascination, yes, I'm sure under the right circumstances they'd still be attracted, even with children. Who knows if they'd move on it; depends on their situation, your game, etc.

On career women who want younger men, would I still fit that range? If so how can I sleep with women who a career driven and just want a young dude to sleep with? Where would I even find them?

Go about +8 years to your age range and you're in boy toy territory. If you're 72 and she's 80, you're still her boy toy.

Try day game, nightclubs, etc. Older women tend to head to certain venues. Sometimes you can find cougar hunting grounds; threre used to be one in Del Mar (north of San Diego) that was literally packed with 40s and 50s cougars and 20-something men. Was the weirdest place in the world if you're not much into cougars, but I guess for a cougar-hunter it's heaven. Check out Colt's articles on these:

Chase

SZ's picture

Oh, I forgot three other questions chase,

1. If you mess up with a chick that liked you so much, like told her friends about you and her sister, but you messed up sleeping with her, so you never did. Would that fascination still be there?
I don't want to sleep with this girl, but when I see her she always wants to talk to me, even when I ignore her, she'll get mad and hit me or something, but she always wants to say hi to me like we're friends, but we are definitely not.

2. I had girls in high school who used to like me a lot, I never made a move, and they got bitter real quick, guess it was auto-regection? they have kids and what not, haha actually they all have like two a piece. Haven't seen them in many years, think they'll still have attraction they had before and I could sleep with them if I wanted?

3. I remember on the older man article, you said you were a boy toy before to a career driven woman.
On career women who want younger men, would I still fit that range? If so how can I sleep with women who a career driven and just want a young dude to sleep with? Where would I even find them?

Anonymous's picture

Would you say a girl from another race can get attracted to another race? Just raw attraction like in this article? Like an Asian girl to a black man, white woman to a black man, Latina to a black man etc. Or do you think that it just stays in the same race?

And how do you feel about black men dating in America and overseas as well. I keep reading forums where people make it seem like it's hard to date as a black man. Think that it's all bull?

That made me think even more now; how do you think it is for a black man to be successful and safe in America or overseas? All I ever hear is things about how hard it is, how racist everyone is, and you know the stuff on the news as well. How can a black man make it and be safe? Maybe I should stay off those forums, these are black men saying this too.

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Anon-

Yes. Raw attraction crosses racial boundaries. Some girls may be more or less likely to feel raw attraction for men of different races, but no girl's immune to it.

Seems to have gotten harder for black men in America than it was when I was learning (was kind of the black man's heyday in the late 2000-naughts), but that's only reduced your probability somewhat, it hasn't eliminated it. Overseas, from everything I hear, it's as good as ever for black men in Northern and Western Europe, where you are basically more popular than men of the native coloration. Asia it's harder, but far from impossible. South America I think it's harder. Africa obviously not too hard.

Safety-wise you're fine if you stay away from unsafe places. Don't go to Eastern Europe maybe, where they're not as partial to black folk and the local men tend to be buffer and more aggressive. You should be fine in Sweden though, the local men are quite soft for the most part. Asia you are fine unless you pick a fight (or don't back down from a fight) with the locals. I've heard of multiple instances where a couple black guys will get into a fight with locals, and then a flash mob of local Asian guys will just form out of nowhere and beat the crap out of the black guys (one Asian buddy put it like this: "The black guys are bigger, but when it's 10 Asian guys on 2 black guys, the Asian guys win!"). Usually in my experience it's either the black guys being assholes to the Asian guys that starts it off, or some aggro Asian guy saying racist stuff at the black guy and the black guy gets angry and starts talking back instead of just ignoring the guy.

Guys tend to blow stuff out of proportion on forums. I'd go places and trust my eyes over anything else. I've been to a lot of countries where I've heard lots of guys complain they are racist against white people there, and while I can see what they're talking about (people looking at you disgusted / some girls reacting like you're a dirty homeless person when you try to talk to them), if you aren't focused on this it's irrelevant. I suspect there's a lot of victim mentality with some of these guys reporting this stuff... Even if every other person you meet is irredeemably racist (and it's nowhere near that much, even if you're blacker than a black hole), it doesn't matter if the other half is friendly toward you and the girls are nice.

Chase

iScore's picture

What do you think is the best way to inhance your nut? Like, have you ever nutted so good and so long that you'll never forget that experience? Does it depend on the girl or the position?

Author
Chase Amante's picture

iScore-

A few tips:

  • Longer sex generally = better / stronger nuts (30 minutes beats 10 minutes)

  • Longer uninterrupted sex sessions generally = better nuts. e.g., if you shag her for 20 minutes but take a break every 2 minutes to not cum, your ejaculation will not be as good as if you shag her for 20 minutes straight without a break and then ejaculate at the end of it

  • Ejaculating in her raw, or especially impregnation ejaculations, tend to be more powerful

  • Ejaculating into a girl you think might be cheating and/or seeing other men will tend to be more powerful

  • Getting fully immersed into the experience before you ejaculate leads to better nuts. e.g., focusing completely on her body, on pounding her as hard as you can, on pulling her body into you as hard as you can, etc.

  • Holding back as you near ejaculation leads to more poweful nuts. Hold back as long as you can, then release your nut when you can hold back no longer

  • Ejaculating at the same time the girl is orgasming leads to more powerful climaxes in both you and her

Chase

Jimbo's picture

"Ejaculating into a girl you think might be cheating and/or seeing other men will tend to be more powerful"

Yeah what's up with that? I was reading that forum the other day of guys who make their women sleep with other men, and they basically come in three flavors: those who enjoy feeling inferior to other men or that they women prefer men who are superior to them in some way; those who get off on seeing their women being sluts or whores, like they become more attracted to them as sluts who cheat and bahave as such; and finally the third type is what you say, they like fucking their girl when they know other men have, like sometimes right afterwards, and especially when other men have ejaculated in her. One guy was in Afghanistan and he was telling his girl to go screw other men while he's away because then he'll wanna screw her even more, like compete with them. That last type is just weird, as weird as the first one (and that's saying something), but it seems to be pretty common.

Pete's picture

Can not having for a long time make you depressed? I read people on the internet saying it shouldnt and that you should just focus on your goals. But man, I still think that not having sex makes you feel bad. I think its a basic need for good psychological health.

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Pete-

Depends on your mindset, but if sex is important to you I'd reckon yes.

Anything you want that you're unable to get is liable to make you depressed.

That's all depression is: a "I have to figure this out" obsessive cycle within the mind, where the mind attempts to solve a problem it doesn't know how to solve (such as: I wanna get laid, but I'm not getting laid. What do I do?).

Chase

Ryan's picture

Chase, you also say attraction has an expiration date. But in this article you say attraction can neither be created nor destroyed. So which "attraction" is meant here? My experience: I often found if you fuck it up with interested girls, they don't give you any chance to put you in a position to make yourself attractive again. But if you bump into her after a year maybe, she's interested again and might give you a shot this time. So I would say you can fuck up fascination/attraction by doing stupid shit or not escalating. Would be cool to hear your insights.

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Ryan-

Great question.

The expiration date on attraction refers to excitement; this is the attraction that expires. As soon as she switches from "I hope he X!" to "He's not going to X", excitement is done.

The problem is when excitement fades, she often goes into auto-rejection at the same time, because she has to protect her ego from feeling like the reason you didn't give her what she wants is that you did not want her. In auto-rejection, your value becomes invisible (or less visible), and her fascination with you is a part of that.

Bump into her a year later, and her smarting over your 'rejection' will tend to have faded, and she won't be auto-rejecting you anymore. At that point, if there was fascination there, she'll be feeling it again, and you may be able to get something going again.

Chase

Tim-H.'s picture

Interesting article, enjoyed the read. A question came to my mind after reading it:

Is this the reason so many people start to date their ex-boyfriend/girlfriend again? I don't mean the kind of "I don't have any other options" thing. Let's say time passed, months/years later they meet again and - bam - "it" (fascination) is still there? I mean...there has to be some kind of a basic pattern behind it, since it happens all the time.

After all...it means that if "it" is there at some point, fascination will always be there no matter how much time passes and how people change, right?

Milhouse's picture

Do you think the one exception to this is when marriage couples tire of each other after years of being together? while there are indeed couples that last till old age/death,most don't. and people usually marry the ones they are fascinated with. (although I'm aware that some people marry just for the sake of marrying,desperation,money,etc.)

Just another question,although it is true that "attraction is not a choice",do you think you at least have some control over who you fall in love with?

I ask this because I know this woman,who I still lust after even though its been years since I last met/been involved with her,but after getting to know her,I knew that deep down,this is not a good person and getting involved with her further/again could ruin my life,and so I never got involved with her ever again other than masturbating to sexy/bikini photos of her that she's posted on social media (I thought this lust will eventually disappear,but I still do this from time to time even years later. I have no desire to ever get into contact with her ever again though,and am satisfied with just using her hot photos to do the dirty deed,lol!)

I'm definitely not in love,(although I definitely came very close to falling when I was with her) so this makes me think that while attraction may not be a choice,you do at least have some degree of control over who you fall in love with. or am I just the odd smart exception? I do know that many men,even after learning the girl they are with is not a good person,still try to make it work because they are blinded by the feelings caused by fascination.

Comment to fascination and question to online dating's picture

Hi Chase,
My comment is late, but hopefully useful and it comes from online dating experience. I am interested in what you think.
First, I think that fascination is not an on/off switch, but a has actually three positions - your "off" position breaks down into "not-fascinated-but-still-liking" and "no-sex-possible" subzones (here, no amount of excitation will help you).

Chase, I think that a common problem in online dating is something I would call "virtual pre-fascination". You know, when you meet a woman in real life and exchange numbers, go to a date etc, it's already real. However, in online dating, the woman wants to meet you based on a picture she has made of you in her mind... therefore virtual pre-fascination. The problem is how much this picture is far or near the real you.

My question to GC - what do you think, does the virtual pre-fascination affect her real assessment of you? I mean, when it comes to fascination, what is a difference between a woman meeting you in real life and between the same woman creating a pink picture first and then meeting you in real life?

The reason I ask... I feel that following situation might be quite common in online dating:
- if you met the woman in real life, she'd be not fascinated by you, but put you into "but-still-liking" and let's see...
- however you meet her online; she loses her pre-fascination in fraction of second after meeting you live and because she feels kind of deceived, she puts you right to no-sex.

Thank you, Tom

max martin's picture

Hey Chase,

great article. I was thinking about the same concept you describe as fascination recently and it would even explain alot of "love at first sight" experiences people have. My guess is that alot of subconscious stuff like genetic compatiblity tie into it as well as, and a level of randomness which is beautiful. Anyway: I was wondering if there's a way you can tell right off the bat if a girl is fascinated with you or if you just excited her for whatever reason, or is it always just a feeling thing, a hunch?

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