Don’t Talk About Fight Club and Take the Red Pill | Girls Chase

Don’t Talk About Fight Club and Take the Red Pill

Chase Amante

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An interesting thread, I noticed, had popped up on our discussion boards the other day, with guys hashing around about the “manosphere” and its various merits or drawbacks.

There were some comments about how a guy started out here on GC but went over to the “manosphere” because it suited him better. There were others from other guys talking about how they started out in the “manosphere” and ended up here and found this site to suit them better. And then there were some rather balanced posts discussing the various similarities and differences and strengths and merits of each.

I, though, would like to take a brief foray into exploring some of the mentality behind much of the most vocal and grating “red pill”-esque thought you will encounter, and that of its predecessor, “Fight Club”-esque thought; if you know what I’m talking about, then you either can’t stand it or you think it’s the best thing since sliced bread.

fight club red pill

If you’re not too familiar with the pickup community or the manosphere, this’ll be new but hopefully still interesting for you, from a “social dynamics within social hierarchies” standpoint. If you are familiar, it might give you something interesting to chew on.

Chase AmanteAbout the Author: Chase Amante

Chase woke up one day in 2004 tired of being alone. So, he set to work and read every book he could find, studied every teacher he could meet, and talked to every girl he could talk to to figure out dating. After four years, scads of lays, and many great girlfriends (plus plenty of failures along the way), he launched this website. He will teach you everything he knows about girls in one single program in his One Date System.

GET CHASE’S ONE DATE SYSTEM

Comments

Anonymous's picture

Goddammit Chase you said it perfect. This is why I frequently visit this site.

Anonymous's picture

I'm glad for this article. Personally, I don't care for the alpha/beta, skilled/pathetic, cool/dweeb, etc... All I care about when it comes to casual dating is getting laid, and it is kind of obvious that while there are commonalities between what women want (what you call fundamentals), there are enough different kinds of women that are looking for different kinds of things, and the more rigid you are about following a template of what a man is supposed to be, the more you are limiting your pool of women.I have much to learn from you and am still a beginner, but it seems, rather, that what is more important, is to be consistent with a particular woman, rather than being consistently the same person with all women. I have been closer to a nice guy, a playful guy, a silly guy, and a sensual guy with different people, and as long as you have balls and are careful about others' reputations and forward about your intentions, it's often just a case of not screwing it up.

D'EmpeRoR's picture

The third world countries and pick-up mentalities.

I have read series of GC posts for the past months ranging from mindsets, picking women, relationship 101, etc to mention few. But I haven't come across any posts relating to the nature of seduction games in the third world countries.
I have been in this most populous West African country - Nigeria for a couple of years, but the cultural, religious, social lifestyles and environment, the pick up games and dating mentality here is some what different from that of the European countries and other Western parts of the world.

THE NIGHT CLUBS
Night clubs here is something of 'no-money-no-pickup', no matter how sexy you may be or how fine you lay your fundamentals, without money a girl would hardy follow you home - picking up girls in clubs is strickly on financial bargain (even if you have zero social skills). Here, a girl is willingly to go suck your corck to dryness and give you any position on bed if you can pay the money bargained.

COLD APPROACH
Though, cold approach here is a bit normal like other countries but you've got to polish your fundamentals so fine, else no cheese to crunch, it's a bit fine but the prime mentality here is like ''NO SEX ON FIRST DATE, WE JUST MET'', (but I know if the game is well played, that resistance wall will definately be broken). On average, 95% of guys here fall on the Nice-guy and chaser quandrant. I can't just remembered how many 'bittered-nice' guys I've coached for the past months, (with the help of GC posts I've read and my little experience gathered so far). One funny statistics I have discovered here so far is that :

(a). 90% of GIRLS you'll meet will say; '' I already have a guy'', ''i'm in a (serious) relationship'', ''I'm with someone else''.

(b). 90% of GUYS you meet will say: '' I'm single'', ''I'm searching''.

WHERE ARE THOSE GUYS DATING THE 90% OF GIRLS CLAIMING TO HAVE GUYS. Could it be that they are say those as a tool for laying off guys? (so I believe anyway).

My question and suggestion here is: How can the good results be achieved here?

SUGGESTION: I would suggest a post on such topic relating to the dating and pick -up mentalies in those kind of countries so that guys in this forum or anyone can learn something important, should they go to such countries. ASAP.

Still anchored to the moving train,
Thanks!!!

David Riley's picture

Hey D'EmpeRoR,

I will let Chase and the other authors know about your request.

Take care,

Just Dave

D'EmpeRoR's picture

Really appreciate that: Thanks alot bro!

michael raphoni's picture

im from kenya,and yeah in the third world cash seems to be mo important,
but all rules remain tru and flaunting cash will result in u pegged as a potential boyfreind.
tight fundamentals imply u got cash but dont do expensiv dates....
i get first date sex easy(year ago did not believ there was such a thing)

momo123's picture

I've been frequenting this site for the past two and a half years, and although I'm a member of the board, I don't have time to actively participate in it being a college student with no time. Anyways, I've came here to say, Chase, you are a revolutionary. I've been doing alot of soul searching these past three years, I've gotten to a point where I break down alot in my life. I see the social hierarchies, I understand the way women behave and why the do what they do, I understand social groups so much more than I use to. I'm so much more socially calibrated at this point, my fundamentals have gotten so much better thanks to you. Reading this article today has made me realize a couple things, as a college student. At first, I was all about the fraternity life, feeling like I needed it, like I needed a feeling to belong and to be on that social ladder. However, Ive realized recently that, you're right. All it is, is status jockeying. It's a ladder, and in order to be truely free, from every hierarchy, every ladder, and to be truly content with one's self, one must become a "nomad." You've opened up my eyes to so much, Chase. You've helped me become a man. I finally feel free.

David Riley's picture

Hey Momo,

I'm glad you have found a sense of peace in your life in dealing with liberating yourself from hierarchies. There is nothing like the peace of just being able to be yourself and go with the flow. Either way, I hope things continue to get better for you in the future.

Take care,

Just Dave

J.B's picture

Would you say Roissy's advice on using alpha/beta is flawed? His insights into a women's mind rival your own, just a different tone/style. It would be interesting to see if you could compare both your styles in a post. I love G.C, one of my favorite sites but I also love old school Roissy's insight and advice, lot of ugly truths brought to light regarding women. Perhaps he's jaded, a cynic, thus why he preaches in a cold, blunt, yet in a brutally realistic way. You mention anyone who considers himself an "alpha male" has a weakness, what do you think is his? Interesting article, a refreshing interpretation on the "red pill" mantra.

Author
Chase Amante's picture

J.B.-

I stop by his site occasionally (usually when someone links me to it) and he has some great stuff. I especially enjoy some of the research he digs up and includes in articles.

I almost feel like the site is somewhat self-satirical - Roissy seems like too smart a guy to view the world in hard blacks and whites, and I almost feel like some of the stuff is half-serious, half-in jest the way he writes things like, "Surely an alpha would know that..." or things along those lines. I get the impression that sometimes the joke is on the people he's making fun of, but sometimes the joke is actually on the readers, and ultimately everyone sort of exists there for his own personal entertainment.

Anyway, the "Alpha of the Month" and "Beta of the Month" is amusing in some ways, and depressing in others. It's mostly based on public images, a bad picture, or a bad event so far as I can tell. A guy may be "alpha" on there because he has a good public image, even if he's a weak shell of a man in his personal life, or he may be "beta" if he happened to be caught in a single moment of weakness when he's otherwise tough as nails. That stuff seems to be mostly for the readers to beat their drums to and feel good about and laugh at the "beta" and deify the "alpha", but as for me, I often feel like I need a hot shower after reading a few articles with stuff like that in it.

Chase

Jimbo's picture

Have you read his "Hitler was a beta male" article lol? His argument was that because the Führer caught oneitis over some chick when he was younger (beta trait) and kind of got bitter to see her going for the higher-ranking men in the military I think.

I think "beta" is just another synonymous of "nice guy" in those manospheric circles.

Zac's picture

Matrix video is down.

David Riley's picture

Hey Zac,

Are you still having problems with it today because I tested it out myself and it played just fine. Let me know if you're still having problems so I can let Chase know.

Take care,

Just Dave

SoraDevin's picture

Hey Dave,

Yeah, Having just read this article the first matrix video didn't work for me either. I'm in Australia and sometimes youtube videos are country restrictive, this may be the problem? Anyway, can confirm having trouble viewing it.

Zac's picture

Hi Dave, Hi SoraDevin,

It can be a computer problem or a country area problem. Check with Chase.I am sure US is okay, but Asia, you might check that one. :)

Don't worry about it, i can see it in another channel.

Zac

LG's picture

I apologize, for this comment is not related to this article. But I wanted to ask about choosing who to approach. I think I have possessed the abundance mentality. I'm beginning to be very comfortable with all approaches and I don't really mind who it is that I approach, but sometimes I sit there and say, no not her. Her neither. Her maybe. And of course I would approach them all, but I don't. Then I just decide that I haven't approached in too long and then go approach someone. Or, and this rarely happens, I see something in some female that I just have to go and meet her. Hope I didn't confuse, and I hope there is some practical solution. Thanks!
P.S. I am very appreciative of this site. It is truly amazing!

David Riley's picture

Hey LG,

Check out the following article, let me know if it answers your question,

Passing Up the Hottest Girls

Take care,

Just Dave

Anonymous's picture

Dear Chase,
I Clearly understand that I aint Tyler,Neo or Bond or as u said will never be content or composed like the movie Icons coz we are after all common men, But still It has advantages looking forward to them as what u want to be.Assessing a situation from their point of view.Would James Bond play games with women ? or how would James bond respond to drama? or a certain situation .And modifying ourselves in to the positive Alpha traits the characters portray.Negative of the equation is there are exceptions we cannot be completely care free no matter how hared we deny that`s the truth ,we cannot be that calm ,composed Bond because somewhere somehow there are people we genuinely care about, people we cannot afford to see hurt.

David Riley's picture

Hey Anon,

The thing I like about Bond is he's focused on his mission. The girl never becomes his mission. He's direct with girls, and they either go with or they don't. He doesn't worry if these girls ever talk to him again because he'll meet another. Girls when dealing with Bond have two choices, they'll either sleep with him or they won't. Games is constantly things toward escalation with women. He isn't sitting around afraid to make moves. Further more if you watched the very last movie that came out, bond cares about his friends and allies. He does his best to try to protect them, and has depth. Given that James is a secret agent, he can't get too attached to people. There have been way to many scenes in the movies were games can't afford to let his guard down. This is just my small analysis about James. I would say watch the movies and try intimate his persona when talking to women. Make moves and don't beat yourself up if it doesn't go well. Leave women with two choices, and make it easy on them. Just my thoughts.

Take care,

Just Dave

Sam2's picture

Chase,

It is indeed liberating the fact that GirlsChase has not gotten into the usual darwinistic terminology we witness elsewhere and this is a great part of why personally I remain an avid reader of this site.

However, the lover- boyfriend distinction that we see here so often isn't it just another form of the alpha-beta categorisation that we see elsewhere? If not, what is the difference?

I have felt many times a "lesser" man whenever I read about the boyfriend vibe and how to avoid it, which I often do, but not in all cases. So, how can a reader of this site not think that he is "beta", if some woman slotted him for one reason or another to this box?

Thanks,
Sam

David Riley's picture

Hey Sam,

To be honest, a good number of guys our site and forums love to be in Long Term Relationships. In previous Girlschase articles, Chase and Ricardus put emphasis on dating women on your terms. Basically, you're the leader on the relationship and calling the shots. When you're calling the shots you would essentially still be the alpha in the relationship. If we were going by the alpha/beta logic. Now a man becomes subservient or beta in a relationship when he is allowing the women to call the shots. He's doing things that he doesn't want to do, she disrespects him, she flirts with other guys in front of him, etc . . . These are just a few examples. Anyway, don't consider yourself a beta for getting into a relationship with a girl. Because a lot of guys share that same end goal. The thing to keep in mind is the girl leading the relationship or are you leading the relationship.

Define from the beginning what you like in your relationships and what don't like. Set boundaries and see where the girl fits. If the girl doesn't want to submit to your boundaries or your standards, don't commit. A weak man just commits to any woman. A strong man commits but a women will submit to his standards. You basically filter out girls who don't fit the build. This will give you better relationships, avoid fights, and drama down the road. Anyway I hope that explained things a little better for you.

Take care,

Just Dave

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Sam-

Good cautionary note!

I've seen a few guys in comments or on the forums trying to treat lover vs. boyfriend as a new alpha vs. beta dichotomy... I always try to shoot it down when I see it. It's a pretty natural inclination of guys to want to categorize and rank themselves, but this isn't a helpful way to do it if you ask me.

I stress turning yourself into the lover because it makes things easier to sleep with women. However, you can still sleep with them (with somewhat lower odds of ending up with them) in the boyfriend role, using date compression, and if you want a long-term relationship with them you will HAVE to switch to some mixture of the lover-boyfriend role eventually anyway.

I also caution guys that while lover may be more desirable from a certainty of sleeping with her / speed of courting her perspective, a woman also values the boyfriend candidate more highly than she values the lover candidate. The only reason she's willing to sleep with the lover faster than she does the boyfriend is because she doesn't value him as highly and doesn't put as much pressure on herself to do things perfectly with him, make him wait, and make him value her and see her the way she wants him to.

Guys will want to rank the lover as superior because this is a site mainly about getting girls and the lover gets the most girls. Thus, he's at the top of that hierarchy. However, it isn't actually a hierarchy in the real world, and simply a different stylistic direction - the advice here is simply, "If you want more sex and a higher likelihood of getting the girls you want, take on this role."

There will probably always be an undercurrent of people wanting to slap themselves into ranks and hierarchies whenever you have any kind of distinction and differentiation, but as long as I'm around I'll always do my best to see to it that "lover" and "boyfriend" never become useless, polarizing caricatures of themselves on here, better fit for status jockeying than they are personal development. The day that happens is the day the terms become destructive instead of helpful.

Chase

Anonymous's picture

Thank you chase for all the invaluable information you've provided on your website .
It has helped me a long way . My question is not related to this particular post . I was wondering if an early morning date is preferable or not and if so , how to proceed with the date . Thanking you in advance .

David Riley's picture

Hey Anon,

You could make that work by meeting up with a girl for coffee. Get her warmed up with good conversation. Learn about her and build a deep connection. Frame the interaction as sexual. Lead her back to your house and escalate physically. Then have sex with her. As a long you have an end goal in mind, and a path you can make it succeed.

Take care,

Just Dave

Anonymous's picture

Yeah, we should chase the truth that really counts in really life, not become somebody who boasts about his stuff and thinks that it defines him in every situation. I somehow think this one quite popular article http://www.cracked.com/blog/6-harsh-truths-that-will-make-you-better-per... fits here and in context of choosing how to live.

David Riley's picture

Hey Anon,

I've scene and read this article before. It's a great refresher for guys and encourage new guys to watch it. Thanks for sharing again, everyone should at least watch Baldwin's speech. It's a very refreshing to reread and hear that speech again.

Take care,

Just Dave

anonymous's picture

Great post Chase, tonight will be my first night going out ever. I'm 19 andI'll be going out alone because I heard that's beneficial for new people, and because I don't really know anyone personally who's serious about pickup. If anyone has any advice for me that would be greatly appreciated, thanks.

David Riley's picture

Hey Anon,

Check out the following articles.

Going Out Alone
Guide for Going Out Alone

Let me know if these help.

Take care,

Just Dave

US Constituent's picture

Finally, someone who isn't a tool while offering advise and not trying to turn everyone else into tools. Thanks alot Chase.

Me's picture

fuck man these articles are too long

David Riley's picture

Hey Me,

If these articles seem too long, I suggest taking breaks and reading the information in parts. This way you get a better understanding of the material you're reading.

Just Dave

Deuis's picture

There it goes....I'm waiting for you to define the undefined man.. hahaha
I never liked the sound of alpha male so I was thinking can you still sweep women while not being an alpha of the group....then there's my answer..And there you define the "undefined" man.... I know being alpha is not your style too Chase...

David Riley's picture

Hey Deuis,

That's the best thing about not labeling yourself. This way you don't have to worry about conforming to someone else's standards other than your own. Like Chase said it allows you to live a happier lifestyle. I never bought into the whole alpha/beta thing. I always was just trying to get better with women and just aimed for that. Anyway, just wanted to throw my two cents in there too.

Take care,

Just Dave

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Deuis-

Here's a question then: if you define the undefined, does it remain undefined? If not, then are you defining the only true undefined as that which is unable to be defined - but then did you not just define it regardless?

Chase

J's picture

bruce lee was the man and he described this in a bit less words

“empty your mind, be formless, be shapeless, like water. now you put water into a cup, it becomes the cup. you put water in a bottle, it becomes the bottle. When you put water in a teapot, it becomes the teapot. Water can flow or it can crash. be water my friend.”

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Always a great quote from Bruce Lee, J.

Chase

Julian's picture

Funny thing Chase. The Nomad will one day be it's own cult group. Where everyone is running around talking about how free they are and mysterious they are playing in the shadows, while all the others are still locked in their defined prison. The paradox will be how these people will the defined undefined.

Anonymous's picture

Hey Chase, what do you think of Owen Cook (aka Tyler durden) and his material on RSD? To me it seems very different to the style you teach. Personally GC makes more sense to me, but I'm wondering if you find any of Owen's stuff valuable, and if it's worth investing time into his approach.

SBM's picture

You know, for the last year, I bought into all that red pill alpha/beta nonsense. To me, the theredpill community seems to be a place that wants to mold nerds/geeks/dweebs/social outcasts into muscle headed jocks and sociopaths. Like I said, I bought into it, I started acting like a jock, and putting up a hard ass front towards everyone, and it just wasn't me at all! If anything, it was starting to drive me insane cause I felt like I've been losing my identity. Another thing that really erks me about TRP is that they believe that women are not capable of loving men, and are only out for their resources and to ride the cock carousel. I bought into that BS for a while and it got me seriously depressed, and only led me to avoid all women like the plague thinking that nobody was worth it.

Its good to know that you see TRP for what it really is, Chase, just a place for bitter men to go to bitch about women, granted they do have some decent advice out there, like being dominant towards women, working out, and working on yourself, etc. I've stopped taking TRP community seriously regardless. Instead, I've been following this guy Corey Wayne, and watching his videos on youtube, and his advice, along with yours, makes alot more sense to me, from a rational standpoint.

Jimbo's picture

I bought into it, I started acting like a jock, and putting up a hard ass front towards everyone...

Just curious, did it get you any results?

Sin Nombre's picture

"This is about the guys who’re mad as hell and they’re not going to take it anymore." - I don't see that "Howard Beale" quote often, but when I do I'll always think about that great scene from the "Network" movie!

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