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Female Mind

A look into the way women see love, life, lust, and relationships.

Tactics Tuesdays: The Friend Zone Date

Chase Amante's picture

friend zone date

Sometimes you’re out and about and you meet a girl and take a number from her.

And for whatever reason, she isn’t all that attracted to you.

Yet for whatever reason, she still gives you her phone number.

And then for whatever reason, she agrees to meet up with you.

But you can sense this one is going through the motions.

It might not quite be the friend zone yet, but it’s pretty darn close. And she doesn’t even know you.

So what do you do... just meet up with her anyway and hope you can change her mind?

Well, you CAN do that... but if you don’t have a game plan for it, it’s like opting for a few games of Black Jack when you don’t really understand how to play Black Jack.

There’s some chance you walk away with winnings, but most of the time you’re only going to waste your time, probably going to waste your money, and if your ego’s wrapped up in it you may well take a self-esteem hit too.

So let’s set out some strategy for those “friend zone” dates, and talk:

  • Prevention,
  • Treatment, and
  • Cure

What to Do to Date Women from Different Social Scenes

William Gupta's picture

women social scenes

“Why don’t these sorority girls like me?”

I asked myself that question for four years. At parties, I would see them hooking up with guys who I knew were not as attractive as me and were half as interesting, but here I was surrounded by guys who all looked, walked, and talked the same, and yet I was going home empty-handed. At first I thought it was a race thing. I am African American and Indian, the girls I was pursuing were Southern white women, but that wasn’t the case. I had black friends who were in frats that had no problems with sorority girls.

I graduated without figuring out why girls would rather go for a guy who’s just like the rest than a guy who’s different. It wasn’t until I had traveled the world and dated all types of backgrounds, did I realize what was keeping me from bedding these sorority girls.

The issue was that I wasn’t playing their game.

Think about this: these girls had invested thousands of dollars to be part of Greek life. They spent hours a week devoted to their sorority, and even more time talking about their group. Their sorority determined what they wore, how they talked, and who they dated.

So why would they choose to date a guy who wasn’t invested in that reality at all?

Why Nice Guys are Boring to Women

Chase Amante's picture

nice guys boringRecently, a commenter asked a question about my article “12 Traits All Boring, Unsexy Nice Guys Have in Common” – he wanted to know, specifically, why these traits, beliefs, and behaviors are so boring to women:

Chase, I read your article about the 12 traits all boring, unsexy nice guys have. How do these traits in and of itself make a person boring? How does things like believing in karma or watching pundits make you boring? Is it possible that you could write about things men do that make them seem boring to women during conversation or in their actions? I don’t think you have that sort of list on this site.

In case it’s been a while since you read that article, here’s a quick recap of boring nice guy traits:

  1. He doesn’t mind waiting... and waiting...
  2. He wants points for being ‘nice’
  3. He gets upset when the world doesn’t play fair
  4. He believes in ‘justice’, ‘karma’, or ‘just desserts’
  5. He consumes a LOT of media
  6. He thinks women are victims of men
  7. He is extra soft, friendly, and gentle with women
  8. He doesn’t have any interests or passions
  9. He can’t understand why women want bad boys
  10. He thinks women don’t REALLY like sex
  11. He believes he must promise relationships to get sex
  12. He can’t believe any girl could want him JUST for sex

Here’s a thought though; read that list. Imagine a man with those 12 traits. Would you like to have a friend like that? Or would you better prefer a friend who is the opposite of that?:

  • A guy with a lot to do who doesn’t wait around for long
  • A guy who, if he is nice, expects nothing back for it
  • A guy who shrugs if the world doesn’t play fair, then gets back to work
  • A guy who believes you only get what you get, no ‘karma’ about it
  • A guy who isn’t overly plugged into popular media
  • A guy who thinks women and men complement each other
  • A guy who is playful and flirtatious with women
  • A guy with several real interests and passions
  • A guy who knows exactly why women like bad boys... he is one!
  • A guy who knows women love sex (or at least they love it with him)
  • A guy who doesn’t give a woman relationship until well after their first sex
  • A guy who believes women want to take advantage of him sexually

Man, that’s a couple of totally different human beings right there, isn’t it? Do you know which guy you want to be friends with? I know which guy I want to be friends with. It ain’t the nice guy.

Why do those ‘nice guy’ traits make a man so unappealing though?

In Seduction, “You” Don’t Matter (But Her Emotions Do)

Chase Amante's picture

her emotions matterIn a comment on my article about unclear value to a long-term girlfriend, a reader named Xander remarked as follows:

Can you believe that because of this I can never get a girl. I’m good looking guy, and I’ve been successful on college. I don’t write this because I think look and post bachelor title will get me girls, but because I try to seduce them, and because of this qualities they don’t like me. I’m not arrogant and have a lot of male friends. But girls don’t like me, and wouldn’t go on date with me to save their lives. Problem is that girls with lower ambitions wouldn’t go with be because of attainability, and girls who are a bit ambitious also don’t want, because they want someone less ambitious who they control and feel dominant around him. The biggest problem is my success at college, and my normal ambition to be good at my job and further education. So I can’t be their boyfriend because I equally want to provide me and them, or their lover because girls here clever guys treat like they don’t have a cock. Global crisis hit us and a lot of girls are in found provider mode, and they are too picky and only wants to date man who is completely same as they in all possible things. And as you know it’s impossible, they find one provider and eventually marry him. I realized that being good at science is one way ticket to auto-rejection.

Reading your article I realized that in all world women want compatible man, but here it is more than dramatic. Those are modern times and I think that women should be more flexible.

My problem is because I tried everything I could and did’t get results because of their ego. I know I shouldn’t but I started to really hate women because of their ego who is bigger than Mount Everest.

At one point I gave up from seduction, but this article tells me that maybe there is a chance. Please tell me Chase are there more things I can do or change so I could get better results? If you know some psychological books that treat problems about ego please tell me. Is there something in seduction I should focus more? I focused on social calibration and got a lot of male friends, but women still don’t like me because maybe I’m not calibrated enough, and for sure because they don’t like anyone who has evan a little bit value than they. Every answers, comments and critics are welcome.

While long-term value is definitely an important part of whether a woman is willing to stick around in a long-term relationship with you, its effect on actually lining up dates with women and getting them into bed is... murkier. That’s because it’s quite hard to sniff out your real, actual long-term value from a mere five or ten minutes of conversation.

So, while it might sound like Xander’s problem is the opposite that discussed in this article, where we talked about men who say women don’t want them because they aren’t valuable enough, in many ways it is in fact the same problem:

The man is focused on himself, the man... instead of on her, the woman.

15 Signs a Girl Will Waste Your Time

Chase Amante's picture

girl wastes timeI see a lot of guys starting out who devote themselves to trying to hook up with girls who are, to a more experienced eye, clearly just bad leads: they’re women who are willing to continue to hang around a guy, and continue to let him hope he has a chance with them (whether because they want the attention, or because he is too blinded by hope to pay attention to the clear signals they’re sending him).

The sad thing about distractions like this is that a girl like this will literally waste your time – you could be off meeting women who legitimately like you and find you attractive (and would very much like a roll in the hay with you), but instead you squander your entire outing on a woman who, for all practical purposes, really presents very little value in exchange for the time you spend on her.

Now, it’s all well and good for you to make female friends and get to know women better, and, particularly as a beginner-to-intermediate, you should absolutely be doing this (in particular, make friends with the demographics of women you’d most like to date, so you can empathize with and relate to these sorts of women more easily).

However, one thing you should not be doing is confusing women who have no intention of shacking up with you for women worth your persistence and sticking around for.

That in mind, here are fifteen (15) signs a girl will waste your time... and that you should probably cut bait and move onto the next girl.

Why Relationships Fall Apart, Part 4: Boredom

Chase Amante's picture

This is the fourth and final installment in my series on why relationships fall apart. The previous three parts you can read here:

  1. Why Relationships Fall Apart, Part 1: Game-Personality Disconnect
  2. Why Relationships Fall Apart, Part 2: Long-Term Value Unclear
  3. Why Relationships Fall Apart, Part 3: Stability Issues

In this article, we’ll talk about the last reason relationships will fall apart. That’s boredom. However, because it’s a topic we’ve discussed before, I’m only going to skim over what we’ve previously discussed; therefore, to get the full understanding on the subject, I strongly recommend you read (or reread) these articles first:

Now, in Part 3 of this series, we discussed the difference between men and women when it comes to relationship goals: men want peace, while women want progress.

What happens when a woman feels she’s achieved all she wants or cares to achieve with a man, though? What happens when progress is at an end – not because he is unstable, but because there’s simply nothing more she feels the need to secure with him?

Well, at that point, the challenge is complete; the game is won.

And, much like some game you’re stuck in once you’ve already done everything there is to do with it, there’s nothing left for her to do but feel bored.

bored relationship

Girls Chase Podcast Interviews Ep. 9: William Gupta

Chase Amante's picture

Girls Chase author William Gupta (read his articles here) talks race and dating with Varoon Raja. Namely, how big a role does race play, what are the stumbling blocks different racial minorities run into, and how can men of minority backgrounds succeed with all types of women?

Topics covered in this podcast include:

What to Do When She Cheats on You

Ethan Fierre's picture

Being cheated on sucks. It’s emasculating. It can feel like you’ve been judged somehow inadequate as a man.

Thinking of her off texting some man to meet up so she can let his big, hairy cock fill her up when she could’ve spent the night with you… it’s enough to drive a man loony.

she cheats on you

As you mull the situation over more, you begin to wonder if she wasn’t faking it with you the whole time. She never appreciated you. You aren’t deserving of love. That despite your best efforts, you still aren’t good enough. You don’t, per say, know what you aren’t good enough at. All you know is that the state of “good-enough” is forever and deplorably outside your grasp.

If you were to happen across a Freudian at this time, you may start to think that this all ties back to some oedipal attachment to one of your parents. Why didn’t mommy love me! Etc. etc.

After a nap, you dismiss that curious early-20th century fancy and return to more sensible fuming about the matter at hand. The image of her happily embracing that devil of a man crosses your mind. You refuse to hate him though. She wants you to butt heads with this laughably inferior man-child over her!? What a joke…

“But why would she do this at all? From a neutral, objective perspective, I’m clearly a better lover/boyfriend/etc. than that guy…”

When she cheats on you, you may feel something like what I’ve been describing. Most of us have felt this way at some point or another. I surely have. It’s an unfortunate situation – and it’s even more unfortunate because in most cases it could have easily been prevented.

Why Relationships Fall Apart, Part 3: Stability Issues

Chase Amante's picture

relationship stabilityThis is Part 3 of my series on why relationships fall apart. Part 1 was on game-personality disconnect, when the approach you use for getting her clashes unfavorably with the version of ‘you’ she gets to know while actually dating you. Part 2 was on the problem of your long-term value to her being unclear, when she doesn’t see the value there from you she wants or expects in a long-term mate.

Our topic for today is stability issues; basically, when she feels insecure in the relationship.

If you’re a veteran of long-term relationships (or even had your fair share of short-term ones with as-yet hopeful girls), you’ve no doubt heard the following common refrains:

  • “What are we?”

  • “Where is this going?”

  • “I need to know this is headed somewhere.”

  • “I just need to know I’m not wasting my time.”

What a woman’s telling you when she utters one of these phrases is that the stability of the relationship is lacking, and she needs you to calm the rocky seas.

These are just the surface of the ocean, however. There’s a whole body of seawater and a thousand leagues beneath it you must grasp if you’re to prevent stability issues capsizing your relationship.

Why Relationships Fall Apart, Part 2: Long-Term Value Unclear

Chase Amante's picture

This is Part 2 of my series on why relationships fall apart. You can read Part 1, on what I called ‘game-personality disconnect’ (where you use one persona to get her, then adopt a different persona in the relationship) here.

Part 2 is on your long-term value proposition. That is to say, if she’s going to stick around with you, there must be a clear value proposition there over the long-term.

long-term value

If you have an easy time sleeping with new women but a hard time keeping them around, it’s likely this issue is your bugbear.

The biggest part of this issue, of course, is understanding the answer to this question: what does this girl require of a man for her to stick with him long-term?

Unless you can answer that, it’s luck you rely on that she stays with you.

Today, let’s talk about how you rely on something more than luck.