(4) Advanced

Growing up, I was shown again and again in film, books, and television that there was precisely one (1) path a man could follow with women, romantically-speaking: date a few people, find the right girl, and settle down.

This never sat entirely right with me, because while I enjoyed the idea of pairing up intensely with some amazing woman, my tastes also changed enough that I also enjoyed fantasizing about pairing up with lots of different amazing women. Not all at once (what a headache!), but mostly more or less one after another. Maybe having children with the different various amazing women along the way. Even while fixated on that one special girl, I could never imagine more than a year or two out into a relationship with her... sort of like most Hollywood films. The movie in my head always ended after the exciting part.

When I discovered the seduction community, I found two more beliefs about how relationships could go, coexisting rather uncomfortably side-by-side with that first. Plenty of men learning how to get girls still aimed for a settled life with one girl they’d commit to more or less forever; some of them because of a lack of abundance mentality, but many of them because that was just what they really wanted, and the cultural narrative gelled with their own intrinsic desires.

Those other two views on relationships are the ones I want to discuss today. I won’t go much into the conventional mainstream view of relationships – you already know that one plenty well enough (and, for the record, I think it’s a perfectly fine and doable path for those who want it), so instead, I want to talk about the other two:

1. The “Committed Relationships are Bad for Men” View, and
2. The “Committed Relationships are Playgrounds for Men” View

... and I’ll also talk about where both of these views come from, and how and why your lifestyle radically colors your perception of relationships.

Alex writes in with a question about a follow-up article to the one on precedent: “Dating and Relationship Precedent: Why It’s So Very Important.” Here's his email:

“Hi Chase and friends at girlschase.com

Your articles are amazing! I found Chase's article on precedent to be thought-provoking:

http://www.girlschase.com/
content/dating-and-relationship-precedent-why-it’s-so-very-important

I was wondering if you guys think writing a secondary article on how to recover after precedent has been set poorly would be a good follow-up idea.

For example: Say with this particular girl, I've moved too slowly with her, been overly helpful, white-knighted her, and acted overly insecure. As a result, I ended up losing her. But what if I want a second chance? Do you have any suggestions on bouncing back after setting poor precedent?

I know it would be best to move on, and I wish I knew about setting good precedent back when I was inexperienced, but sometimes I just want a second shot. I think it would be excellent to have an article on bouncing back after poor precedent, if possible.

Let me know if you guys think this would be a good suggestion!

Best,
Alex”

This is a sticky issue, and it's not one with an easy fix... not even a remotely easy fix. It's also a totally irrational problem to have, in the grand scheme of things, and it's one that's rooted firmly into a scarcity mentality of some sort or another - it may be that you don't feel you can ever meet another girl as amazing as this one (you lack absolute abundance), or it may be that you don't know if you're ever going to find another girl at ALL (just a complete lack of abundance mentality) - or, at the very least, you've just plunged so much time and emotional investment into this girl that your psyche won't let you let go.

The rational option is always, "Go out, forget about the girl you've dug yourself into a deep pit of despair with, get more skilled with women, upgrade your game and your fundamentals, and go date and sleep with 10 more women hotter, cooler, and more interesting than this one."

Yet, it's a question that comes up SO MUCH from guys, that it's probably worth addressing on its own: how do you change a girl's perception of you when it's already pretty low?

It will require you to move mountains and pull off feats that few men ever have, but if you're willing to give it your all, I may as well lay out the tools for you. So, by popular request...

I've been around for a while. As such, I've seen, checked out, or least been peripherally aware of most of the different companies and styles that have gained any sort of popularity over the years.

The intention of this article is not to critique or advocate any particular one, but rather to examine the two different camps that many - if not all - fall into.

Those two camps are:

• Value Game, and
• Sexuality Game

We'll kick off this article with a look at each.

In "Effort Aversion: Or, Why You Don't Work Hard and Get Laid", Gem asks the following about picking up girls with male friends or orbiters around:

“Chase is there a way to efficiently approach girls who have orbiters with them; the problem here is sort of congruent to approaching a set I would think where it's tough to make a smooth natural approach because it isn't one on one.

Lately I've been seeing a lot of girls with orbiters at the gym (it's quite sad really), and my standard approach here has always been to wait till the orbiter goes to drink water or use a separate machine and meet the girl in that break that she is alone. If the guy comes back he may come back or stay away and if he comes and she thinks they're good "friends" she might introduce him (or otherwise ignore him; it makes no difference once I've met the girl).

A great girl I met yesterday took me a long time to approach because her orbiter was with her forever watching her squat ass to grass and not even working out haha. The girl and I met eyes several times but I couldn't approach till the guy went to get water. Finally I met the girl and moved things forward and the guy didn't come back but I remember kicking myself at how long it took and if there were a better way I could think of to do the whole approach would have went for it right then

-Gem”

Approaching girls with male friends hanging around. It's something that can scare you off of approaching at all, at least early on.

Yet, this one's far from impossible, and you may even find yourself getting a kick out of doing it if you're of a competitive nature.

Sometimes it's just fun watching that other guy's jaw drop in frustration and awe as you sweep in and make the kind of connection with a girl in minutes he's been working months to have... and then ask her out and get a "yes."

Of course, there's some nuance here - and chief among the details you need to mind is whether the girl respects the guy or not... and if so, how much.

Because how she thinks about, feels toward, and treats him is going to have big implications for the kind of approach you need to do to make the kind of headway with her you want to make.

Mess it up, and she may friend zone you fast... or reject you outright.

If you've paid much attention to the men that women gravitate towards, they're pretty much all assholes.

Yeah, sure... deep down, they may actually be good guys. "An asshole with a heart of gold", for instance.

But, they're still assholes.

If you yourself are not an asshole though, adopting some of the traits of a guy like this so you can be an asshole can seem like something of a mountain to climb... society keeps telling you not to, but women's obvious mate selections over and over again keep telling you differently.

In "How to Spot a Girl Looking for Men", Michal asked about the path to embracing one's inner asshole:

“Hello, Chase.

This kind of question usually never pops up so I am just gonna ask. How do I become more like a jerk or an asshole? I am too friendly basically, because parents and such always told me to be kind and polite and nice. Ugh! :-s

I dont want to seem as an ass at the end but... I have been trying to be more playful lately, trying some wit and I experiment with my female friends and they seem to enjoy it OR dont get it. And when I meet new girls I am this little kind person again because I dont want to seem awkward.

So how can I stop being viewed as this "kind and good hearted man" who "has no evil in his soul" as I once heard and have better personality that women respond to as if I was a man. Not friendly boy?

My fundamentals are bad and I am working on it but this is my biggest flaw right now. I am ok to have female friends, but I dont want every girl I meet to feel like I am her long lost friend from childhood.

Any possible advice? I guess move faster and dont miss "the windows"?

Thanks in advance.”

Let's talk about jerks and assholes, then - and what it takes to be one.

As you grow and mature, learning how to get better with women, some interesting things will happen to you as a man. Some things that seemed exciting begin to lose their thrill, while other new possibilities will pop up and prove themselves to be even more exhilarating than your earlier adventures.

Another thing that will happen, hopefully, is that your standards will raise for what kind of person you allow into your life. I'm not just talking about women, either: your standards will raise even for male friends and colleagues once you become more confident, find your voice, and begin to stand up for what you believe in.

As your standards increase, and you find yourself being more and more selective about whom you wish to join your reality, you will become more picky. As Chase has written on before, you may even stop dating party girls altogether - a move I wholeheartedly agree with. Sure, they're hot, and yeah, they're fun, but after a while you will begin to want more. You may want more stable relationships, with more grounded women, who can bring more to your life than a shiny new vagina.

And that brings me to the point of today's article. If you truly wish to create amazing relationships with the women in your life, picking up women is only part of the picture. In my opinion, it is equally important to learn how to avoid the types of women who would bring chaos and drama into your kingdom, crumbling your castle with a flick of her capricious wrist.

In "20 Ways to Talk to Women and Make It AMAZING", Flames requested an article on rapport - specifically, one on making it, and breaking it. Here's that part of his comment:

“Oh and if we could have something on rapport, both making and breaking. I've had a few girls break rapport recently and it left me thinking wtf? :)

Regards
Flames”

Breaking rapport is a classic pickup technique for controlling the flow and direction of conversations. It's used as a sort of a "forced redirect" when things start traveling down a conversational road you don't want them to go down.

However, one of the ways it's traditionally been taught is to be used not purely as a redirect, but as a punishment for women who are being aloof, uncooperative, or trying to move things backwards.

There are more ways to use this, though, that both enhance the fun and energy of your conversations - and quickly get women qualifying themselves to you.

The focus in this article is mainly going to be on breaking rapport yourself - though if you're paying attention, most of the extinction examples we use later are really about dealing with women who break rapport with you, first - so we'll cover both sides of the coin about Flames's question about the subject in this one.

Let's see what they are.