Resistance to Sex: The 4 Different Flavors | Girls Chase

Resistance to Sex: The 4 Different Flavors

Yesterday's article about when you should have sex mentioned part of a female reader's comment on the article "I Don’t Chase 'Em, I Replace 'Em." The comment, though, was actually a fair bit longer than that, and touched on another subject too:

While I agree that the 'replace' mentality is efficient for picking up large quantities of women in a short time, I think it limits the quality of the women. I can categorically say, that there is a strong correlation between a woman's desirability status and the extent to which she will require a man to chase or demonstrate interest/value.

Our commenter here has a very valid point - however, the nuance to that point is what interests us most.

resistance to sex

Because, as you will see, how resistant to sex a woman is depends upon:

  • The quality and quantity of her choice with men, and
  • How this man in particular stacks up against her other options

... and that even among resistances, there are very different kinds of resistance to sex, and these are based far more on the woman's level of sexual experience with men, and her level of experience with a man who makes her feel the way this particular man does.

(if you're looking for an article on how to overcome this resistance, we've already got a great post up on it here - "How to Get a Girl in Bed: 10 Crucial Tips for Making Her Yours" - this piece is really about identifying the different kinds of resistance, understanding what each sort says about the girl you're getting it from, and understanding what you need to do and who you need to be not to get it)

Let's dive in.

Chase AmanteAbout the Author: Chase Amante

Chase woke up one day in 2004 tired of being alone. So, he set to work and read every book he could find, studied every teacher he could meet, and talked to every girl he could talk to to figure out dating. After four years, scads of lays, and many great girlfriends (plus plenty of failures along the way), he launched this website. He will teach you everything he knows about girls in one single program in his Mastery Package.

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Comments

Jason's picture

Hi Chase!

I want to thank you for all your help, its really improved my game substantially. A lot of times when I meet girls, I try to propose a time to meet right then and there. However, there are times when the girl is legitimately busy and can't find a time to meet right off the bat. For example, I ask her sat, sunday, etc? In these cases, she usually says she needs to see her calendar. Then, I usually will offer to get her number to coordinate later and then I usually shoot a quick text telling her "save my number, etc". After this, what would be the best response and time to send a response so that I can follow up with her without losing too much value myself? Thanks!

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Jason–

Great to hear you’re making some strides.

It’s been my experience that it’s better to ask a girl for her schedule over text after you get her phone number. Tell her you’d like to grab food or drinks with her while in person and get the number, but don’t go into details and coordinating. Mainly that’s for two reasons:

  • Not pressuring her to know her schedule on the spot, when she may not know it yet

  • Not creating an emotional disconnect – often the mood she’s in when she gives you her number and the mood she’s in while thinking about or talking to you later are very different – you want to set up the date with the version of herself who’s handling her planning and coordinating later, rather than her bar / club / street / café self.

When you ask girls to pick a time then and there, if they feel pressured the gut reaction is usually just to push the decision off and tell you they’re busy. But once they’ve already turned you down once, that becomes the thing they remember every time you talk to them about going out again. They think, “Jason? … oh, right, that guy who asked me out but I told was I was busy.” Then it’s either, “Okay, maybe I’ll give him a shot,” or, “Nah, I already decided on that one.” Much better to get a “yes” in person, let that sink in, and then handle all the details later when she’s clear-thinking and not feeling remotely pressured by your presence.

This article goes pretty into detail about setting up dates with girls specifically that way over text:

How to Text Girls: 20 More Tips and Techniques

Chase

Zac's picture

Hi Chase,

the response to my comment, in the article "How to tell a story....", where you mention the guys who are most successful are ones that change overtime.

(But the people who have the most successful lives - whatever your metric for success - usually are the ones who tweak and change and evolve themselves the most as time progresses. They tend to look quite different from one age to the next in some important ways.)

I know change and being dominant is good, but in all honesty, there's some people who just won't accept the 'new' you. Kind of like similar when you look at a guy dominant and a women becoming subordinate and she feels the instability over time. This is all relative reasoning though, nothing concrete.

(may revert to stiffness and weirdness with you because she doesn't know how to respond and doesn't feel in control - she realizes she may actually lose you if she doesn't go to bed with you, and she isn't sure if she can accept losing you (whereas with other, less experienced men, who don't come across as quite so amazing, she gets none of these feelings.)

You nail this one. But what's the difference between a women shutting you down and another whom really feels that she can't play her game? i have seen the latter. Women who are experienced usually doesn't turn down all so often (unless you really bad) if you got good fundamentals. All too often it is just they are not interested, or am i wrong? in my past girls, with those calm girl, i feel persistence plays a key. i mean not the kind of too much persistence.

Zac

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Zac–

Yes, for sure, some people can’t accept change. Generally that’s only the people who don’t change themselves, though – you will almost always outgrow these people completely if you’re someone who continually evolves, even if you don’t want to give them up as a friend for whatever reason.

As far as shutting you down vs. a girl annoyed she can’t get what she wants, a shut down happens when a girl feels like she’s in control and can call the shots and either isn’t interested and wants you to stop pursuing, or is in auto-rejection and is tired of wasting her time and emotions on you (because she thinks you won’t come through for her) – effectively, she’s a girl who decides you do not have anything she wants. She’ll usually be very firm, or sometimes even mean or cold.

A girl who’s annoyed about not getting what she wants from you hasn’t written you off entirely; there’s still SOMETHING she wants from you, be that friendship or be it a relationship or be it anything else. However, she feels like she “has” you and she’ll push you off in an irritated way – it isn’t a full-stop shut down, it’s more like a, “Gah, doesn’t he GET it? He’s supposed to do [some other thing]!”

You’re right, a woman who’s experienced won’t turn you down because she won’t get into situations where she needs to turn men down – she senses those situations a mile away and deftly avoids them. She only proceeds with a man when she wants things to proceed with a man. And on persistence – yeah. Calm, deliberate, knowing persistence shows an experienced woman that you are an experienced man more than anything else – experienced women tend to be a lot more attuned to this than inexperienced women are and a lot better able to appreciate it. You might say that an experienced woman is a connoisseur of men, in a way.

Chase

Zac's picture

Yea, they know their ways around, how to utilize the nice guys and not overuse him, while also putting guys at arm's length with those she do not have interest.

Btw, I saw your response to "The Tool" Meeting her friends, the topic on ball busting. I remember I hate that when i just getting started to be social, and learning to be good with women. I still do, mainly because of the negative tail it brings with a few people the girls mix up with, at times. It would be great to see a topic on ball busting. Ball busting can be sticky if not handle well, especially with strong headed/independent and even charismatic people, and some of them don't even recover you back if they bring you too down, that's a sign of her not really having good friends maybe? An article will help.

Just maybe i can remove that tail between my legs. It get stuck sometimes.

Zac

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Zac-

Sure thing - I've got it marked down on the list. An article on ball-busting it is!

Chase

Beginner's picture

Hey Chase

I apologize if it's a bit unrelated, but this question's been eating at me.

I'm new to pick up and have been doing a lot of approaches, some dates and a few failed escalations.

I've read your article about determining a girl's number and how it can be determined within 2 partners, but I'd like some more accurate ways to determine a girl's exact number.I want my girlfriend to be a virgin and won't accept one(for ltr) who's had even just one other guy.

I really don't want to break a bunch of inexperienced girls' hearts sorting through them to find a girl who's both a virgin and meets all my other standards.

So how do I do it?

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Beginner–

Well, you’ll need to target younger women – even in most of the conservative countries and areas I’ve traveled through, most women have lost their virginity by midway through college. If you’re living or traveling in more remote places, however, you can occasionally find women who’ve retained their virginity longer. Typically, the larger the town, the more attractive male options there are for women, and the sooner virginity is lost.

The main things you want to look for are youth, religiosity, and sexual conservatism – e.g., women who think that sex outside of marriage is bad or wrong, or women who’ve been homeschooled and away from boys their whole lives, or women who simply do not date.

As far as actually checking for virginity, that’s kind of a tough one. I’ve had plenty of friends have girls tell them they were virgins after they slept together the first time that the friends came to seriously doubt after a little background probing. I even had a roommate in college whose standard fare was sleeping with virgins, who would then wait until they were on their periods to have sex with their later (or current) boyfriends, so that they could tell those boyfriends they were still virgins (i.e., that the blood coming out was from their hymens, not their period).

You can check for hymens, but even that isn’t reliable – if a girl runs a lot, or plays sports, this can get stretched or broken, and some girls are born without much or any hymen.

Even among the guys I know for whom virgins are kind of their “thing” (there’s a guy on the discussion boards right now named “girlsfollow” who specializes in virgins), they’re never 100% sure if a girl they’ve slept with was really a virgin… it’s always more like, “Well, I THINK she was telling the truth.”

I’ve had girlfriends who’ve told me that their previous boyfriends thought they were virgins when they weren’t, simply because they came from conservative backgrounds and they didn’t want the guy to know they weren’t virgins when they got together. It’s just one of those things where, if women can tell you’re looking for it, they may be inclined to do their best to try to be it, even if they aren’t really “it” (virgins, that is).

I guess I’d say, stick to very conservative areas, and go for young women (i.e., under 20 is your best bet in most places; even then, you’ll still run into lots of girls who’ve had at least one partner, and sometimes a lot more, by age 20, so you’ll have to be screening), and look for women with very conservative and nervous attitudes toward sex. You’ll probably never be 100% sure, but if you go for those kinds of girls you’re likely to be more sure than you’d otherwise be when you meet a girl who matches the description.

Chase

Montay's picture

Chase

I've been thinking about how to apply "The Law of Least Effort" latley, because I want to maximise my attractiveness as much as possible.

And although I understand that you need to "appear effortless" I haven't quite nailed down how to get the MOST out of something with the LEAST amount of effort.

So at this point I receive a lot of reward for a lot of effort.

I'd genuinely appreciate an in-depth post/comment; many may benefit from zero-ing in on this particular concept of "Studied Carelessness"

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Montay-

I imagine you've seen these articles:

... and want more technical details on appearing effortless?

Much of the material on the site is actually geared around showing you ways of getting the results you want with women with the least amount of visible effort; e.g., stuff like deep diving for conversations (she does the talking; you mostly lead), things like locking in and moving girls (getting yourself comfortable and getting them following you smoothly), and nonverbal things like using the bored look and the skeptical look to get women explaining themselves or working to regain your interest, and pre-opening to get a woman's attention before you even open your mouth, and essentially create the feeling in her as if she was the one bringing about the opening.

If you have specific areas you're looking for more detail on being effortless in, I might be able to either point you to the right article here, or put one together on it if it's something not covered.

Generally though, most of the stuff on GC's written with the intent of getting you maximal results with minimal effort - I'm a former business process and optimization consultant, after all - I like efficiency ;)

Chase

Montay's picture

Perfect, I love the idea of being efficient and effortless. I'm working on a more edgy vibe/appearance as if now, and I feel that this is a key element in to doing so

I imagine you've done your time with hopping from one extreme to another
Ex: humble to arrogant, friendly to badboy..ect.

And finding a "somewhere in the middle" that fits your profile

It's a long road, but i'm willing to ride it to the end.

I'm not sure how you've come across all this knowledge, and why you don't just keep it to yourself like a fair majority of others would do, but it's incredible, nonetheless. So thank you

Lance's picture

Hey Chase and Ricardus, long time reader, kind of haha, but first time poster.

Essentially, I became friends with a guy my freshman year who was the pinnacle of women's dreams. High school James Bond type guy. And, I spent the entire year chasing after this girl. The "nice guy" phase. despite him telling me what I was doing wrong. then I finally landed a girlfriend the beginning of sophomore year, I'm laughing typing this right now actually. very odd thinking of the transition I've made since then.

Well, she cheated on me and I went into the "dick" phase. Trying to emulate my Bond like friend. Which, sadly, snagged me quite the reputation among a few girl groups. I found this site sometime along the summer before my junior year, and it helped me understand the balance concept. I only read a few pages that I was curious about, and they really helped with a few concepts. So I took that information and have spent junior year and almost all of my senior year implementing principles, as well as exploring different aspects that affect how a girl reacts to different situations. Going so far as to think of something id like to further understand and talk to a girl for the sole purpose of this.

I actually haven't been on here since that time, I actually was sitting in a class after a break up with a girl I had decided to let myself build an emotional connection to. Didn't change much with my tactics, i had just decided I wanted to keep her around for some time. Well, she had some serious psychological issues I had not been told about which led to her ending things with me to keep from losing me in the long run. So naturally I was kind of affected by this. Anyway, sitting in class I was watching this impressive looking girl easily be unaffected by a man who obviously has spent months chasing her around, later found out it was years. But it has only been a few days since then and I haven't gotten to asking her for her number because I just haven't felt like doing it. Either way, I've come up with two questions that I haven't been able to quite find an answer for on here.

1. This girl, I've found out, is VERY clingy and easily attached, which raises the question:

What do you do with a clingy girl? I'm talking, head over heals, always wants to be with you. Do you leave her as is and enjoy what she is offering while letting her understand the concept of "I need time for my friends", or do I manipulate the balance of security and try to make her less clingy? I ask this for two reasons, I'm used to keeping things edgy with girls. That way I know what's going on at all times and am in control. and my bestfriend, fell into the clingy head over heals girlfriend hole, and they have been together for a LONG time, which is something I am interested in experiencing. That's always been the difference between us. He is the faithful, loving, Long term boyfriend. and I am the guy who will go somewhere alone, but leave with a girl. So I'm always intrigued by how their relationship works.

2. I've always known how texting and being a conversationalist works, but I stare at the messages my friend sends his girlfriend with disbelief. Infatuation crawling all over them. He could accomplish nothing without her. I'm wondering, WHY is it that he can continuously talk to her like that, and flower her with security, and her never get bored and lose interest? is she a breed of women that I have just never come across? I'd like to know how it is one picks that kind of women out, and accomplishes the task of getting her into that, mutual permenant infatuation.

As you can tell, recent event with my ex have changed my thoughts temporarily but I have come to one conclusion. I am VERY excited to be out in the "wild" again, haha, but I am looking for an honest, serious relationship. something that lasts longer than three months. Almost 3 years, since that moment that girl cheated on me of going from girl to girl I've come to the point where I would like just one for once.

Thanks man, and I will definitely be keeping up with your blog from now on, offers some incredibly interesting views on some great concepts.

Lance

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Lance–

Neat to hear the transition you’ve made. It helps tons having a solid role model to follow in real life – they were crucially important to my development too. Sounds like you had a good one early on.

Clingy girls will give you drama to no end for the first 3 to 6 months if you resist spending too much time with them. They’re drawing on pools of deep emotion, and want what they want – and what they want is usually you… lots and lots of you. They get necessarily upset if they can’t have it; it actually becomes a need– a very strong, powerful need. Especially with beautiful clingy girls, too, they are accustomed to getting what they want, so the reaction is even more powerful. They’ll admire your power for resisting their urgings to spend night and day together, but they’ll resent you for it, too. You need to tread lightly with these girls and try not to hurt them… it’s easy to give them some emotional wounds if they get head-over-heels and you don’t treat them with kid gloves. Even if you do, if you’re a very strong guy they like a lot, they’ll still be more hurt on losing you than most girls will, because they feel more deeply. So, be careful. But, they can be very sweet, incredibly affectionate, very loving and loyal partners – it’s a great experience if you haven’t had it yet.

On your friend – the younger and more inexperienced and more idealistic the girl is, the less real “game” you need. If you’re the first guy she’s ever been with, you can often get away with doing a whole lot of things that would be big mistakes with more experienced women, who become more emotionally guarded and skeptical and who have higher standards of masculinity for their mates. If she’s still in the 0 to 2 lovers “sweet” phase though, romantic talk is often music to her ears (although, there are girls who even when inexperienced think romance is bosh; that’s mostly just the very rationally- / logically-driven girls though). I’ve had girlfriends for whom I was the first man they’d ever loved, and had them beg me to talk romantically to them and do romantic things, which to me just sounds like kids’ stuff. But, when a girl’s inexperienced, this is the stuff she’s been reading and seeing in books and movies and on TV and it all feels like a dream come true.

Chase

Lance's picture

Your reasoning for the sweet talking made perfect sense. She had only had like two relationships before then and she was his very first. So I can see how the preexposure to movies and cliche interactions between sexes can overtake someone who hasn't been introduced to how things really are.

Also, so seeing how this overinfatuation of clingy women works, I've thought of two questions.

1. Is it better to try and make that clingyness and NEED for the man lower by changing the security level slightly? or would even the slightest security level change make her go erratic?

2. Or.. is it best to stick out the NEED for the man and then.. what happens after that six months? Does it die down on its own? Or does she just suppress it?

Thanks man,
Lance

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Lance–

If you start lowering security levels in an already-established relationship, yes, that’ll make women start getting weird and erratic (because they feel like the earth is shifting and crumbling beneath them). The best thing you can do about clinginess is be very nonchalant about it when you get it, stay calm, and shrug it off. She starts acting lovey-dovey and you say, “You’ll chill out in a couple of months; this is all still new for you. But it’s very cool that you care about me so much, babe.”

Time winds passions down, so even if you do nothing, eventually her passion will begin to fade. Passion is a response to novelty and uncertainty, and the longer she knows you, the less novel you’ll be, and the longer you remain together, the more certain she becomes that you aren’t going to leave (unless you create an inherently unstable relationship where she’s never sure if you’ll leave or not – those are the only relationships in which passion remains to a degree – this is also why the stuff you’ll see on this site all says if you want to hold onto a girl long-term and always keep her interest, you can never let her feel like she 100% has you – there must always be some risk of loss around the bend to keep her guessing, and excited).

Chase

Lance's picture

Thanks man. So in essence, let her wind down, then create a subtle instability to keep her interested. Simple enough.

Thanks again, and I will be purchasing a book soon.

Lance

anonk's picture

How can you find out hidden truths about women like if the smoke?and lets say you find out later how to respond

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Anonk-

See this article, on this topic specifically:

Women's Forgotten Past

Chase

Anonymous's picture

Hello Chase and others,
I have been following every article on this site since December, and this website has really helped my game. I understand women better. I am more confident thanks to things I read on this website. My number of women I speak now (and my chances of getting laid) have increased as well. With that, I wish to give my thanks to Chase and Co. With that said, the current girl I am attempting to bed with is quite a challenge, and I wanted to know whether I for your knowledge (anyone is free to give advice). Let's call this girl, Project P (I will be stating my problem and observation in bullet proof form form now on; please forgive me for the fragmented thoughts and descriptions)

Cynical/Mad chick, probably hates men. I know she has a few bad relationships and has probably been played by three to four dudes

Brought her back home twice -> failed to bed b/c she said "she doesn't trust me"

1st encounter => sweet, nice, cool => did notice how cynical & bitter she sounded when we talked about sex & relationships => brought her and friends home; gave me made resistance just get her number (probably token resistance since her friends were there)

2nd encounter => she invited m to a bar; party environment; no deep diving or getting to know her happened; freak dancing did occur and little bit of physical escalation occurred (kissed her on the neck and she was feeling my thighs)

3rd encounter => she missed her bus to nyc and went clubbing with me; same thing happened as in 2nd encounter; brought her home; once again, acted mean, cynical and bitter; i ignored it and acted like I didn't hear it; refused to bed, so I got her a cab; she joked that she trusted me more than the cab driver and kissed me on the cheek (aka girl baiting to keep me chasing)

4th encounter => we got dinner; was able to deep drive; got her to laugh; noticed how did a lot of things to break the sexual environment I was trying to created by acting aloof, avoiding eye contact, etc; like always, ended the night by telling me "she had fun"

Now we are trying to set up the fifth encounter but since we are both extremely busy, logistics has been an issue. Therefore, fifth encounter to TBA

Things that I have considered that are creating her resistance:
1) the fact I told her from day 1 that "I am too busy to be in a relationship and it wouldn't fair to my girlfriend to be that I can't provide her the attention she wants, however I am open to experiences"

2) the fact that I am still a college student while she is a working lady

3) She is nearly 2 years older than me

My conclusion: I don't think she has friend zone me (yet), as I kept my invest minimal by barely texting her and showing her I am not afraid of to sexually escalate with her. I do think she is trying to see whether I am boyfriend material as she stated me before that she is tired of sexual experiences that have lead to no relationships and during our dinner she has "boyfriend screened me" by asking me questions like "when are you graduating", "what are your ambitions", etc (I could be wrong; she could be conversing). Although she does not state it, she clearly thinks she is more experienced than me. With that said, I do think she is slightly intrigue by my attempts to plow through her resistance, walls, and etc. So my question is the following, how can I turn this challenge into a lover before I get friend zoned?

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Anon–

Yes, sounds like you have her number. Whenever you hear, “I’m tired of just hooking up; what I want now is a REAL relationship,” what that translates into is actually, “I DO hook up with guys, but I’m not interested in hooking up with YOU; however, if you’d like to court me for a relationship, I might be open to that.”

The communication is basically that she doesn’t find you particularly sexually exciting – which happens when you’re new (it took me probably 8 or 9 months of really focusing on developing a strong sexual vibe as my #1 game priority before women started telling me I was sexy and responding to me consistently in very warm, sexual ways, and at the time I was shocked it suddenly happened and had no idea what cause the switch, other than that I’d been chipping away at it for the better part of a year). But, she isn’t writing you off entirely.

So – you’re not going to be able to get her by being sexy and making fast sex happen. You’re more or less stuck in the traditional dating game with this girl, unless you want to start taking chances. You can meet new girls and set different expectations, but if you want THIS girl, you’ve mostly got to hope to win the boyfriend competition by being the best boyfriend candidate you can be. That’s wining and dining her, getting her some little gifts, taking her on interesting / fun / exciting, and ultimately romantic, dates, and ending somewhere private and romantic – e.g., the two of you alone under the stars after a romantic hike, etc.

The outside option is finding a way to go around with her a bit and get very physical – LOTS of touch (your leg against hers while sitting, your arm around her, loads of physical contact) and just lots of proximity, and maintain the “I’m not really boyfriend material, but it’s fun hanging out with you” angle you’re going for. This works sometimes when you’re a beginner and don’t have a sexy vibe down yet, but it doesn’t always.

Chase

Boris Bayemi's picture

Thanks Chase,
This pretty much confirms what I was thinking. Luckily for me, I usually do speak to more girls. Now about the sexy vibe, this is something I have been working on. I started hitting the gym more, dress better and be more dominant. However, I still get the "boyfriend vibe" comment from girls I speak to.

Ivan M's picture

Whats up Chase. I've been following your blog for the past eleven months now and I have really learned a lot since then while reading dozens of your articles. I do have one question thats been buggin me a little though and thats is how to approach women when people are around. When I'm at school, I see guys trying to appraoch girls in a loud way and the girls just brush them off in a get the hell away from me kind of way. So I'm thinking that maybe the girls don't like to be approached in front of everybody maybe one on one. I do better at talking to girls when nobody else is around and haven't really tried talking to them when a lot of people are around. What do you think about these kind of senarios?

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Ivan–

The problem with talking to girls in front of people – anywhere public, really, but especially in a hyper-status-focused place like a school hallway – is that the interaction is instantly transformed from being not just “you and her” but “you and her and how that looks to everybody else.” The effect is such that you aren’t even the main consideration; the main consideration is “What’s the effect on her reputation to be seen getting approached by you?”

Basically, if you want to do approaches in public at school, the goal should be to target girls who are of equal or lower social status to you. That way, the calculation in her head goes, “How does this look for me? Oh – it’s good! They’ll see me talking to someone higher status than me.” There’s still the off-chance that the girl is conniving and thinks, “Now, if I REALLY want a status boost, why don’t I let all these people see me blow off this guy they think is higher status than me? Instant boost of my status ABOVE his!” If you’re cool or popular enough though, this only makes her look like a bitch and she loses status for brushing you off.

Aside from approaching girls of equal or lower status, I’d stick to staying out of public view when doing approaches – that way you can stick to keeping it about you and her, instead of you and her and how that affects her reputation.

Chase

mark's picture

is that on the guy or a chick on the left?, lol (whoever it is, they're wearing lipstick)

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Mark-

It is a guy, yeah. The male modeling industry is home to predominantly homosexual men - many of them are very "manly" men, with big muscles, etc. When I had a profile on Model Mayhem I used to get invitations from guys routinely wanting to "take pictures" of me, and asking if I did nudes. I suspect there's a lot more going on at most of these shoots than just picture taking.

But, even if the guy in the picture isn't gay, a lot of times models still put makeup on to look better in high definition photo shoots. When you're being shot in HD you have to have foundation and a little lipstick on usually to keep your skin from looking pale and washed out.

The photographer there may have been going for something stylistically, as well - a lot of red being used in that shot.

Chase

Wes's picture

Hey Chase,
Recently, all the girls that i've been talking to, I've come to find out have boyfriends. Boyfriends that they love very much. so I gave up the chase on them and now I want to replace them...there's a few girls on campus I have in mind. There's this one girl I've been seeing around since last semester who I haven't approached yet.(for lazy reasons) I always and only see her in the on campus computer lounge and she's usually on a computer not too far from me, concentrating on her work. Basically she looks really busy. But we've made eye contact before until she turned her eyes away. i don't think I've been auto-rejected at all yet...but I really starting to wonder how I approach a familiar face that is also a stranger.

I know I should've approached her the first time I saw her but I wasn't as educated back then.
I was thinking of saying: "hi, I see you in here all the time.(compliment her) and you have me wondering if there's more to you that meets the eye than a pretty face.

For some reason I'm afraid of messing this one up because she is one the few girls that are high quality on my campus. Its amazing that she is so intimidating, I don't really see a lot of guys talking to her. She's always alone. (or maybe I'm the only one who finds her attractive)

anyway, I'm rambling...how would you handle this?

Author
Chase Amante's picture

Wes-

I've found that with girls you keep seeing repeatedly (e.g., girls who always work out at the same gym as you, but you never talk to), when you want to talk to them, it's best to do it very casually, as if you're an old friend and the two of you've talked many times.

e.g., "So what's the assignment today?" She says something, and you say, "Oh. That sounds like something you'll really have to power through to finish." And she'll say, "Yeah," and then you'll just let it die.

Then, the next time you see her, you say something else: "Still working on that paper on dorsal fins, or they have you onto ventral fins now?" and she'll say something, and again you'll make a remark and let things fade out, unless she keeps the conversation going with you, of course.

Third or fourth time, you start getting into some real conversation. You can move her by saying, "Here, I want to show you this - come take a look at what my professor has us working on," and then show her something ridiculous. Don't do that until the third or fourth time you're talking though - you want it to feel like you're old friends already, talking very casually. At that point, you can get into a real conversation, and then propose that the two of you grab food or a drink sometime and trade numbers.

Chase

Wes's picture

That's good! Thanks. Also for the girls that told me that they have boyfriends, should I have kept trying with them or was it a good idea to move on. Also there was another girl i've been talking to and she said she wasn't into black guys but she liked my body type.( shes the girl that I have all kinds of sexual tension with that I talked about in the boards one time) I stopped trying with her. Was this a good idea ? I honestly didn't see the point in trying for someone who wouldn't be interested. Maybe she was shit testing me in some way?

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Chase Amante's picture

Wes-

She's using a barrier - something we discussed in "Being a Challenge to Women" - it's a way for her to tell you she likes you without putting herself totally out there. e.g., "I'm really attracted to you but XYZ thing means we can't get together." It is, essentially, an invitation to chase her.

In this kind of situation, if you're not certain you know how to get the girl, it's usually best to walk away - you'll just squander a lot of time and energy, and it often goes nowhere. Girls using barriers have high confidence and very tight game; until you reach that level yourself you'll lose a lot of time giving her attention while getting very little in return. She may be interested... but she also may not be, and she's more interested in you chasing her than anything else.

Chase

DavidSalv's picture

I have been reading, studding and practicing the issues in these articles almost everyday, and the results are amazing ... :D
Thank you Chase , Ricardus and all the team !!

Now one of the girls that I'm dating is older than me (I'm 24 , she is 30 ) and she has exactly this calm attitude that you have described here. It is like she is always in control and anticipate all my moves. She is always challenging me.
Once she even told me "haha this type of game you are doing may work with other girls, but with me it wont work... ". Other times she says that she wants me or says " I think you should be good in bed " :)
I think this what is called the "Push and Pull", and it is so stimulant and funny to talk to a girl that fights you back that way , I have learned a lot with her.

For example, one strategy that she uses is that when we book some date she always let me know that she has something to do after our date so we can only stay together for like 1 or 2 hours, therefore it is impossible to invite her home.
Like you said I know she wants to sleep with me, but I also know that it will only happen when she wants and where she wants.

I'm trying to keep calm as you recommended but this girl is driving me crazy because I can't move faster. Do you have any recommendation to speed up the process?

One last thought, even though she is a very sociable person and a very sexual women, she told me , without me asking, that she have had only 6 lovers (2 serious relationships + 4 "one night stand" ) . I know that almost women lie about this number, but it is very far for from the 20 that you said.

And I will finish saying that Chase is one of the most talented writers on the internet. How can I learn to write and communicate the way you do ? Any idea to start?

David Salv.

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Chase Amante's picture

David-

When you're going up against a girl who's a lot more experienced than you are, you generally won't be able to take back control, though you can try. You can try only being available for something where she comes to your place, for instance - e.g., you're tired / super busy, but if she'd like to come over you'll cook a great dinner with her, and you politely decline anything else. But by this point she's kind of got your number, and is likely to call your bluff and turn these invitations down. She knows she can do things on her terms with you, and won't go for you trying to change the dynamic this late into knowing one another. The only thing you can probably do is go the traditional dating route with her at this point and just try to be her most attractive option... and, keep meeting new girls in the meantime ;)

On partner counts, the old rule of "take what she says and multiply it by 3" really does usually apply. When I was younger I used to think that was rubbish and that I was better at telling which girls were being really honest with me and which ones weren't. As I got older, I'd have some girls blurt out months later into relationships that actually, they'd lied, and it hadn't just been 2 guys, there'd been this other guy, too. Then a month later it's, "Well, actually, there was another guy I didn't tell you about as well." And the more experienced a girl is, the less telling you a little white lie about how many men she's been with weighs on her consciousness and the happier she is to let you think she's chaste and virginal if that's what you want to think (that's why I made a "how to tell" article... you'll get a much more accurate read going off her actions and behavior than you will what she actually tells you, which even with the most trusting women you can almost always expect is a lie... but don't take it personal, she lies about it to everyone).

On writing - well, experience! I've been writing a long time. But I wasn't always terribly talented. Check out the post on mastery here if you haven't yet: How to Master Anything; and, get a copy of Stephen King's On Writing... it's one of the best reads you'll find on the topic, period.

Chase

Micheal's picture

Hi chase,
I dont know if the girl I recently know is classified as calm girl. I know this girl and dated with her once on Tuesday. We couldn't go to bed since she needed to wake up early in the following morning for her lecture. Both of us are Master Student on different courses though. Then I texted her for a second date ( a more perfect on Saturday) but she was also busy with her school trip so I must told her that : ok, we'll make it another time.
Since then, every time I text her, she often deflect my text. She is quite calm in her appeareance and able to deflect any of my text message especially when I text something she could deflect.
For example : I tried to be a bit more dramatic when she refused my date invitation. She : 'It is cold today, and I feel a bit down. I really don't want to go out.' Me : 'uhm, to me, It was warm thinking seeing you. Any way, its just personal feeling, never mind :)' . She : kk, you make me feel like I am your heater :)), I can not ignore it but today is really cold, dont blame it on me =) '
And in the end, she just keep refuses so I let her go. What do you think, should I text another time, more persistent (Since she always replies my message. If I am warm, she is warm. But still, I am always the initiator. So she is actually on the upper hand ?) or I should just move on ?

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Chase Amante's picture

Michael-

It sounds as if either you missed the escalation window, and she's going cold (disappointment over wanting something to happen, regardless of her schedule, but nothing happening), or the two of you never really hit it off on the date and she isn't that excited. Many women will reply just to reply, and like to keep men around in their lives even if they aren't making themselves sexually available to those men (see: "The Sad Tale of "Shopping Guy"").

If you still want to try with her, I'd advise trying the second date strategy from the second date article: basically, get her out somewhere she'll be able to see women attracted to you again to restore her interest. Even if it isn't a failed escalation - if it's rather that she never got all that excited - it sounds like at this point she's replying just to be nice, or just to keep you around her, rather than to take things anywhere.

You can also try letting her cool her heels for a while. Don't contact her for a couple of weeks, then get back and touch and see if she'll meet up. If she lost interest after date #1, if you're lucky and she doesn't meet anyone else in the meantime she may want to take another shot after a few weeks go by and she starts convincing herself that maybe she ought to give you more of a chance. But, do pull out your A game on that next date and make sure she knows she made the right choice...!

Chase

Anonymous's picture

You base the distinction on experience alone, but I verified complete calmness (and a little tendency to become manipulative) might come from... other sources. Psychological School training, for example. The whole focus of this training is making the pupil extremely calm in any situation. Be aware, and... very open about it, while dealing with the subject.

Anonymous's picture

Chase--recently went on a date with a girl who's firmly in the 4th category. 9-9.5 on looks and probably a 10 based on the full package. She's 28 and I just turned 24, though she said she prefers to date younger guys.
We had one drink and went back to my place. She effortlessly shut down my escalation attempts as if I was a child (in a warm way though). Said that she had to work on a school project due at midnight (night classes) and couldn't stick around very long (in fairness she mentioned this at the beginning of the night). I went into semi auto-rejection but she still said "see you soon" yada yada when she left.
Few weeks later and she's flaked on a number of dates. Always returns texts immediately and very warmly and texts back paragraphs. She invited herself over to my place for drinks on Friday then cancelled the night before.
She's unemployed and looking for a job and just got dumped by her BF of 2 years. Seems like she's going through some shit. On the date, she was long sleeves and long pants during a heat wave and body language was fairly closed off despite her showing lots of interest verbally/facially. Sorry for the novel--should I cut bait on this one?

Eliasmusic's picture

Dear Chase, I have recently been experiencing a lot of last minute resistance taking girls to bed. Specifically with girls saying they're 'on their period.' This happened twice recently: The 1st time I pushed through (turns out she wasn't on her period) and we had some great sex. The 2nd time we were almost completely naked, grinding alot, but I couldn't get her pants off (although in retrospect I should have out-framed her as she's been hitting on me for weeks.)

Firstly, I'm wondering what it means when girls say they're on their period... to believe them or not, and even if they are, surely they'll still be keen for sex right? What do I do here?

Secondly, I'm wondering why I receive so much last minute resistance in general... I'm very attractive, girls chase me a lot, so I don't understand it. I spend a lot of time kissing and grinding before slowly taking clothes off piece by piece. Should I just rip her garments off like an animal or what??

Cheers again, hope your happy and content
Elias

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