What to Do When a Girl Won't Go Home with You | Girls Chase

What to Do When a Girl Won't Go Home with You

girl won't come homeA reader named Konstantin writes in:

Hi Chase and the team!

I have read most of your articles, and especially those on moving fast and inviting her home. I have a question: it happened to me quite a few times now that I invite a girl home with me, and she gets ever so close to coming, but changes her mind at the last moment, and there's nothing I can do to change her mind back. Just tonight, actually, she was giving me some resistance, but got off the subway at the stop next to mine. But when "our" train was arriving, she suddenly said, once again, that she should go home, and after three "no"s I let her go. I knew for a fact that she liked me, but what did I do wrong that prevented that last push from happening? If you can answer that in a post or an email, that would be very much appreciated.

Few things in seduction are quite as irritating as having a girl you’ve spent an hour or two or more talking to and working with and navigating around countless social obstacles bail on you 2 yards from the goal line.

It feels like you’ve been suckered... that whole night, which you had already checked off as “in the bag”, in an instant goes 180 degrees and becomes a fruitless night.

Most of the time, when you have a girl bail on you like this, you will never, ever hear from her again, either. You switch from being about to become lovers, and possibly entering into each other’s lives for a long time hereafter if you both really get along pretty well and want to keep seeing one another, to being a couple of strangers it didn’t work out with (and you’re some guy she “almost made a big mistake” with).

So what do you do when a girl won’t go home with you?

Chase AmanteAbout the Author: Chase Amante

Chase woke up one day in 2004 tired of being alone. So, he set to work and read every book he could find, studied every teacher he could meet, and talked to every girl he could talk to to figure out dating. After four years, scads of lays, and many great girlfriends (plus plenty of failures along the way), he launched this website. He will teach you everything he knows about girls in one single program in his Mastery Package.


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Anonymous's picture

In last year article "Social Value and Value Imbalances" you said :
"he's been providing a woman with all of his time, emotional support, and conversation, and he's gotten NOTHING for that, and almost certainly never WILL get anything for it! It's a pure value drain
…Women who maintain these sorts of one-sided relationships, meanwhile, get upset at the suggestion that a man might want something from them - I thought he just wanted to be friends! goes the emotion; you mean he WANTED something from me?! What a creep!! But these friendships are rarely two-ways - the woman doesn't help the man with his problems, or provide a shoulder for him to cry on, or come running at his beck and call; he's there to provide emotional validation and support for her, and what he gets in return is the hope that MAYBE, SOMEDAY he MIGHT have a shot with her." First of all that is not friendship at all !!!
Second - lets be honest here-that maybe, someday actually mean NEVER. You know it, she knows it. So her continuing this kind of behavior is very pathetic and manipulative, dont you think? My line of thought is that this kind of behavior must be punished. ( not abuse or anything like that ) but take it away everything you can give her, and disappear from her life.Reason? I give you everything i possibly could, and sex in return goes to some random dude. Well i am not interested goodbye honey !!!
If you didnt punish such manipulative behavior you actually reinforce it dont you think?
I would like you to shed some light on this !
Thanks in advance, best wishes, you are the MAN !!!

Chase Amante's picture


There are varying levels of "manipulation"... all of which somewhat depend on the eye of the beholder. A child crying is "manipulation", in a way, to try to get the parents' attention and get them to help it. Some manipulation might be more conscious than others - some crying might be a purely unconscious emotional act; some might be half-conscious, half-emotional; some will be fully conscious. Where you draw the line between genuine and manipulative is entirely subjective... I've met some folks who would consider any crying at all, no matter how "innocent", to be manipulation; I'm on the opposite end, where I'd laugh at any crying that was obviously fake and view it as silly and cute.

I view women the same way - things I can tell they're trying to do to keep me on the hook are silly and cute; little games they're attempting to play, that I find I am better at avoiding than they are at playing. If you've been caught in these games before, of course, you may find them much less silly and cute and much more "diabolical." But rarely are they conscious machinations.

Nearly every woman I've talked to with men on the hook genuinely considered those men usually as a potential worst-case scenario backup, OR as someone she told herself she WAS vetting... just, very slowly... or other times would laugh at the idea of dating a guy, and then state that she was very clear that she just liked him as a friend, and he knew this (even if the guy himself was in denial). I can't recall ever having met a woman who rubbed her hands together and said, "Yes... he thinks he'll have me as a girlfriend... the FOOL! Little does he know that he is my puppet - and when I say 'dance', he dances!"

So I suppose it's down to what you consider pathetic behavior, and depending on how wide you cast the net, almost any human behavior could be looked upon in this light. The man providing for his family? He's just desperate to keep his wife around and keep his children's respect. The mother doting on her children? Manipulating them to get their love and affection.

The more I've learned about people, the less I've been able to view anyone as "manipulative"... since everyone ultimately seeks to find the right buttons to push in the people around them to cause them to do what he wants. Some try to do it with sweetness, some with fearsomeness, some with pity; but they all have their means. To me, that's just people being people.

As for punishing it... well, walking away is negative punishment - removing a liked stimulus - which does de-incent a behavior. But you should be doing this anyway; don't chase, replace. It all comes down to though whether her behaving this way more likely gets her what she wants, or doesn't, from the various men she meets. You may walk away, but a bunch of other men will continue chasing after her, wanting that carrot dangling on the stick in front of them, and so the behavior endures. Women with higher empathy won't do it because they realize what they're doing to men and feel bad; but then, men with higher empathy won't chase the carrot either, because they realize how the woman waving it around truly feels and won't waste their time.

In a way, the friend zone is a case of the blind leading the blind; one unaware person pursuing another. The only real cures for it are awareness of the other person involved, or hard rules to prevent one's own involvement.


Anonymous's picture

Quick question Chase.

Lets say you set up a date with a girl and she flakes, saying she can`t make it, or not calling/texting at all..
How long do you wait before calling/texting her again?

For example, i follow your process of asking girls out on every 2nd call... I chat them up in one call and ask them out in the next..
But i set up a date, the girl flakes stating she can`t make it, i assure her that it is okay, i tell her to do her work/obligations that she has and we`ll set up a date another time.

And this is where it hits me, i can`t seem to know when to call her afterwards..

Should i wait a day, two, five or how long ??
It bugs me for quite some while now....

Chase Amante's picture


Very much depends on the situation, but I’d strongly recommend securing the date before you ever take a phone number - see this article: “How to Get a Phone Number from a Girl Every Time You Ask.” Then you won’t get nearly as many flakes, and you won’t have to deal with trying to figure out the details on this one.

If you can’t plan that out in advance, because it’s online dating or some such, and she flakes after a call, I’d follow up with a text maybe 4 or 5 days later asking if you’re still on and when’s good for her.

As for what girls mean when they want to know what you’re doing later on, that’s nearly always a booty call. The correct response is, “Watching a movie and eating popcorn at your place with you.” If you tell them to come downtown with you, it’s too much work; she just wanted a man to come to her place and give it to her, nearly always. So you’ll get a flake here because partying is too high effort when all she wanted was sex.


Anonymous's picture

Another quick question, a girl called me tonight, asking what i was doing later on... I told her i was out but that i would be free and she said to me that she would come down to town to meet up..
But that she still wasn`t sure whether she would be availbe or not as she was expecting something the whole time (didn`t say what that was, i didn`t ask either )

Time went by, she didn`t call or text afterwards and i just rang her once, she did not answer and i let it be..
Note: We haven`t met each other yet, we met on facebook, exchanged numbers, tried to set up a date 3-4 times, nothing happened, we keep in touch and we have amazing conversations, she is also having fun and enjoying talking to me,
and i am curious as to what she wanted out of all this ?
Was she testing me ?
What are your thoughts on this one Chase..

JDB's picture

Hey Chase,

Your site has been something of a lifesaver for me. I was just on the border of giving up completely with women when I stumbled upon the vast knowledge here three months ago. It's been incredible; using simply deep diving and my natural personality I've gotten farther with women and quicker than I ever could have fathomed. Now I realize I have to invite her home and I tried that for the first time on a date yesterday. I asked her to invite me to her home. Naturally, I failed. I've read the articles on women's objections and I have a few questions.

I asked her during a high point of our interaction, so check that.

I know I didn't persist strongly enough and that's where I get a little lost.

I asked "I don't know what time you have to get up in the morning but lets head to your place so we can watch a movie and hang out."

She protested "saying she wanted to take it slow"

Now I know I should have said "How slow should we take it?"

But my question is if she keeps stalling, what is the best method of persistence, how many times do you persist with suggesting something harmless like "hanging out, a private chat, or a movie" until you get the point of pulling out the "hard push" like " I like you, you like me, this happens tonight or it may never happen."


Anyway what happened after the failed pull, I gave her a hard stare and a few seconds of silence and we kept talking the both of us got up and took a walk. We went on a little romantic walk by the pier and I said the hell with it and kissed her romantically. As we were getting ready to part she said "I hope to hear from you again soon." So I know I'm probably in the boyfriend category, not that I'm opposed to it, she's a cool girl.

Chase Amante's picture


I’d only recommend kissing in public for when you’re more advanced, or if you’re just working on it for fun with no expectations of sleeping with the girl - see this article: “How to Kiss Girls in Public and Have It Go Great.”

I wouldn’t suggest anything too time consuming like watching a movie later at night unless she’s clearly extremely into you and you already know she isn’t getting up early tomorrow. Saying, “I don’t know what time you have to get up in the morning,” only primes her to think about this, and if it isn’t late, she’ll stress - I think you were trying to use the line I use during daytime dates, which is, “I don’t know what else you’ve got planned for the rest of the day, but if you’re not too booked let’s watch a movie,” something I use when I’m 95% sure she doesn’t have anything else going on because it’s 2 PM in the afternoon on her day off and she probably doesn’t have any more plans until dinner or later. Better bet for nighttime is, “Let’s grab a nightcap,” because any time reservations are easily brushed away by assuring her you’ll only go back for 15 or 30 minutes. If you’re out partying or running nighttime street game, you can also invite her to an “after party” (that really is the same as the nightcap).

“A private chat” or “hanging out” is pretty obvious it means sex, so you don’t want to use that phrasing unless a.) she’s clearly pretty liberal, and b.) she’s clearly very into you and raring to go.

Persisting, so long as you can calmly and adroitly address her questions, is a judgment call based on how likely you are to see her again. If you’ll DEFINITELY see her again, and she doesn’t seem like she’s clamoring for it now, drop it immediately and don’t push. The harder you push, the more committed to it you are, and the bigger a deal a “yes” or “no” will be. If you’re going to push, go all the way - keep persisting until she gets up and walks away, or until you give up and throw the towel in completely because you’re out of ideas for how to push any further. Generally to pull off a hard push, you’ll need to ask/insist between 3 to 12 times… it essentially becomes a battle of wills, and whoever gives up first is the one who forfeits the frame.

And, if you ARE in the boyfriend category, no great loss, provided she’s looking for a boyfriend - there’s still always date compression!


Chase's picture

I really like this site,and I think it would be great for a genral post on getting girls in highschool.
Thank you

Chase Amante's picture


Nice name. We do routinely get requests for posts on high school, but unfortunately not of our writers are much experienced on the topic. Richard, one of our senior discussion boards members, does have a post up on it on the boards worth reading here though: "High School Pick Up."


Anonymous's picture

Hey C.A.,

I think you should write some article about pregnancy issue.
I mean about the ways to take proper attitude at her resistance due to 'what if i get pregnant, i will not have sex with anyone until I can be sure I will be ok with accidental birth, and there is no true way to be sure we will avoid it'...
Well, and another issue may be - what if she blames you for making her pregnant... When maybe there is another guy who made it, and really when that child is yours it sucks, cause it is no good for ones freedom.

And maybe even this site should have article about hygiene and looks, cause some guys have great personalities, but they miss out on such fundamentals like preparing body for pleasurable, not stinky physical connection. :)

Great Job!

Chase Amante's picture


Noted on the article on pregnancy. I will add that one to the queue.

Likewise on hygiene - but, you may not need to be as pristine as you think. Although I certainly found the term "stinky physical connection" amusing...!


blogster's picture

Do take your point on this one. However, at what point does all the game advice for men cross into the territory of a woman's jurisdiction?

With each piece of advice about how to handle situations and tighten your game, it sees more and more of the woman's responsibility being transferred over to men.

One of the admirable traits of men generally is that we are self-motivated and proactive and take charge. We look for our own mistakes and correct. However I feel the manosphere and valuable dating advice sources such as girlschase makes the mistake of swinging too far with the attitude of 'if it didn't go well, you the man did something wrong, or should of done something better'. Accountability is good, assuming complete agency is ridiculous and unrealistic, as it assumes the man has the capacity to control all relevant circumstances affecting a pickup and that by improving and fine tuning technique results will come.

The implications for this are obvious - women are just automatons and have no individual preference, attraction will occur reasonably successfully if you master the right techniques smoothly and ultimately, that women have no agency as adults.

It also plays into and reinforces current societies frame regarding relationships - that the man must do all the work and its the man's fault if something goes wrong or the seduction doesn't occur.

Increasingly also I see double standards in advice being doled out. For example, a recent post spoke about how to deal with judgement. It says its crucial not to judge women, yet women are by far the more judgemental sex and constantly do so on a broader range of factors.

A man is expected to skilfully disarm a woman's judgements, but a woman is not expected too because otherwise she 'won't open up'. Does it occur to you that maybe men don't open up because of female judgement and thus lose out? Yet the onus seems always on the man. Put it this way, if your friend was constantly dodging responsibility and being unnecessarily judgemental would you pander to him?

A man is expected to overcome his approach anxiety by himself. Is there any advice anywhere that says about how women should 'help the man through his approach anxiety'? Of course not, yet there is plenty of expectation that a man should smooth and ease the women in the last moments before seduction.

In this instance, I feel it pushes the 'responsibility balance' of game even further towards the man. Soon all the woman will have to do is show up!

Chase Amante's picture


I'm aware you already saw it (way behind on getting caught up with comments here, I am), but for anyone just tuning in, I wrote up this article as a response to Blogster's thoughtful comment here:

"What Role Should Women Play in the Mating Game?"


Anonymous's picture

I attend a large university that has its own bus system. Approaching girls at these bus stops is easily my most frequent opportunity for day game, but I'm having trouble with what to say to open. Chase has suggested "Going anywhere exciting?" for bus stops, but that seems more suited to standard bus stops where the girl could be going anywhere. In my case the girl would obviously be going to class so I think another opener would be better. Is "What class you headed to?" any good or are there better possibilities I'm missing?

Also, there are several buses that take multiple routes, so often the girl would be taking a different bus than I would. Even if we do board the same bus, she could be getting off at any moment. It's not exactly sprezzatura to ask her which bus she's taking and where she gets off and try to time the conversation based on that, so I really have to move quickly, possibly in less than a couple of minutes. Should I even bother starting a deep dive here, and if not, how do I quickly connect enough to get her to agree to a bite? Since I don't have any control over when the conversation ends, is it okay to get the number sort of in the middle and then continue until one of us leaves?

Finally, there are nearly always several people hanging around in close proximity at the bus stops, often in dead silence. They will almost certainly overhear any conversation. Should I adjust what I say in the interest of discretion or should I act as if the girl and I were alone? Any help on these points would go a long way toward my progress. Thanks!

Chase Amante's picture


Not having dealt with your situation precisely, here's what I'd use: I'd open with a very casual, "Heading to class?" followed by a, "Must be on the 29 bus," based on whether she said yes or not. She'll say "no, I'm taking 42", and you'll say, "Ah, then you must be going to XYZ building," and she'll say no, ABC building. And you'll say really? What class do you have in THERE? And she'll tell you. Then a little light banter / small talk. If you're feeling it and a bus is coming up, then, "Well, there's my bus," or, "Here comes your bus," followed by, "Let's grab a bite sometime, shall we?" followed by trading cell numbers.

I'd just keep everything very light and casual, that way anyone who's paying attention will think it sounds like just a regular small talk conversation, which it is. You're relying almost entirely on your fundamentals in an approach this compressed - either she's going to go for you, or she isn't, and you can't be too worried about what response you'll get either way. Keep approaching this way and you'll hook some girls.

If she's riding your bus, of course, take things at a more relaxed pace and board the bus with her. By asking her which building she gets off at early on in the conversation, you probably know how much time you have to chat on the bus.


Anonymous's picture

Hey Chase, this recent one was really painful.

So a friend is visiting me in Mexico on vacation and we went out to sushi. We sat down to eat and this incredibly attractive woman was sitting next to us alone, so i started up convo with her talkin to her throughout dinner she was in town because she broke up with her boyfriend and decided to come down for a few days. I asked her if she had plans for the night, she said she'd go home, drink wine and listen to music, so a little later I made a comment along the lines of "you're not sharing that wine with me" and she said no haha. The sushi place opened up this night club as part of the restaurant right next door a couple months ago, so we told her they have drinks and music and that maybe wed chill there.

A little while later she asked me to guess her age and i said 45, I thought more like 30 or something haha i always tell them way older than I think. Then I said nah 38 and apparently was right.

Anyways, she ended up deciding to come for drinks with us and I told my buddy when she was coming that the only way I'm sleeping with this girl is if he left at that point and took one for the team. He already told me he wasn't going to try at all because it was obvious her and I had some serious sexual tension going on. But my buddy is pretty clueless and a bit of a jealous cock block, so he just laughed and stayed and it pretty much ruined things. I'm not sure what else I could have done once we were drinking. I'm sure I could have tried a few things but I know she's a very private woman, doesn't use Facebook and we discussed how we both value privacy very much. I do think if I was alone with her that I would have left with her to her hotel. She had two drinks with us and then took a cab back to her hotel and that was it.

I'm not sure how you play a situation like this. I'm pretty damn sure this hottie wanted a fling with me that night, but I also knew it wasn't going to happen with my friend staying there. Appreciate any feedback. Thanks

Chase Amante's picture


In addition to the comment below (from Anonymous as well!), the easiest way is usually just to give the friend a command in a calm, nonchalant tone of voice along these lines if he's clearly not getting it: "Well all right man; we're going to head out of here [gesturing toward the two of you], so I guess this is where we part ways. I'll catch you later, brother."

If he whines, complains, etc., then you just get faux sympathetic (like you would a whiney child complaining that you won't take her with you) and say, "I knoooow, but it's just us two going to grab a drink... you'll be all right on your own. I'll catch you later, man," then get out of there.


Anonymous's picture

It would have been cool, if he just bounced instead of being a cock block. It's tough because of the man code: bro's before hoe's.

For the friend: It depends how long you know this guy, like 3 years best friend, or you just met him, and if you want the friendship to go on. I would have said to him something like, "can you grab a drink with us, then try talking to another girl, or switch bars or something else for the night. I will owe you one." In a favor type of way, so that you get what you want with the girl, and he does not feel snubbed. Guys gotta realize to let each other go for the gold. I had a good friend who was real religious christian, so when we went out we made a deal it was just guys hanging out not to crazy and other nights I would go out with other friends when I wanted to mingle with girls. This worked. One time he was cool with me talking to a girl though.

If your friend is still not cool with it, why is he your friend if he is so selfish to cock block you? haha. Besides that I would have thought of another place to go with the girl secretly than suggested to the group, its getting late and switch to another location without the friend (another pub, or switch to her place.) The friend would not follow you if you are calling it for the night, really though you are going to hang out with her some more at another bar/restaurant or her place. That has worked for me, when I need to ditch someone clingy. It has ended well that way too.

Anonymous's picture

Yeah, I screwed up big time. Even though he still stayed, and it was a very empty scene, maybe like 5 other people there, I still should have mentioned to her that we should go back to her place. It was a huge mistake. This was honestly like the perfect moment and this woman was ridiculously hot.

She clearly wanted me to make it happen and I didn't. Her patience ran out and she left. I'm never letting that one happen again. Shame I had to make the mistake myself. Oh well.

Anonymous's picture

Another great article Chase

Thanks for your reply to my question on “Learning to Target” in the http://www.girlschase.com/content/why-you-absolutely-need-assume-attract... article. The reason I asked the question is because I enjoy putting the effort into mass approach at the moment, but I know that when I target who I approach, my results are more efficient. Problem is, I've only been practising game for around 8 months and don’t want to be arrogant enough to presume I know enough to target as well as say, you can, yet.

You've mentioned in the past how nowadays most of the time you normally target who you approach. I would like to be at this stage at some point, but not until I've put in the necessary hours, doing mass approach. Having some kind of time or amount of years goal to work toward would allow me to do this.

If it’s the case that setting a year/s goal is too inflexible (I guess it’s hard as you don’t know my history with women, have no idea how experienced/inexperienced I am etc.), could you recommend some other kind of point at which I would have enough experience to focus my energies on targeted approach?

Thanks again Chase

Chase Amante's picture


If you need a hard objective, maybe set one of "40% of my target reads are right on the money." That is, when you see a girl and say, "THAT girl is going to be incredibly receptive to me," you go approach her and 40% of the time you take her home. Or whatever number you feel like picking.

This way, you're gauging by your own skill level, rather than an arbitrary amount of time, which may be too much or may be too little. Go by skill, and you'll be good. (I don't do this myself, since, contrary to the way this site is set up, my learning is almost entirely intuitive with little use of metrics, but if you need a numerical goal to target, I'd absolutely go by percent accurate rather than time passed)


Anonymous's picture

Hi, I would like to know what types of women you find attractive just out of curiosity. Perhaps you could list out some women who would be searchable via the internet?

Chase Amante's picture


Sure... that's always going to be different from person to person, and I'm not too familiar with a lot of celebrities, but one porn/glamor model I was into the look of for a while goes by the handle "Jenya D." I liked her look enough that I specifically filtered for girls who looked like her, and took a girlfriend who looked a great deal like her in 2010, with a similar face and a body very similar to what Jenya looked like before she got implants. A few other glamor models I always liked were Aria Giovanni and Veronika Zemanova.

From Hollywood, there haven't been too many women I've found terribly appealing, but Kate Beckinsale was one I've always found quite attractive.

And as mentioned in "How Much Do Looks Matter for Romantic Success?", I had a girlfriend for a while who looked a lot like one of the girls pictured there - that's one of the looks that certainly appeals to me.

Large (natural) breasts, thin waists, and good faces (or good in my opinion, for what it's worth) are the most important aspects to me... I'm less of an ass man than a lot of guys are, for instance.


J $'s picture

What do you do if you don't get laid for a long time chase?
Let's say you're a beginner at cold approach and keep getting rejected, but you really want to have sex and go extremely crazy because you're approaching, getting rejected and not getting laid. Do you just get a prostitute? Do you try to find a girl online? Or do you fap? I choose not to fap to much because I feel weak as shit after doing that.

I ask because I know that ill have to approach a lot to get numbers, then ill have to get dates, then I have to get sex. Each of these areas you have to get better in and it takes time. It's the thought about being brought down emotionally by frustration that you have to wait months for each of these things to progress to just get laid.
So what do you do to please yourself when you have to go through this learning phase without going crazy?

Chase Amante's picture


I'd recommend giving yourself a release every so often - maybe once every two weeks or so, you can indulge in a little manual stimulation to blow off some steam.

Not so much that you send yourself into an unsexual stupor, sated by your own hand, but just enough so that you're not a complete morass of pent up sexual energy.

Also, if you can, get another outlet you can use to transmute that energy into something constructive - art, sports, working out, starting a business, all these things are great ways to channel your unspent sex energy into doing good for yourself and/or the world. (Nikola Tesla used his to perfect both direct and alternating current electricity, for instance, and Newton invented calculus to vex school students for generations)


Gem's picture

Hey Chase,

I wanted to ask about something that I’ve observed from a young age but that’s always stumped me, since early childhood: how come you typically don’t see lots of really serious intellectuals/bookworms that also game and get laid a lot; why are smart guys typically nerdy and not cool/good at game while simultaneously being smart. From early in grade school (like 1st, 2nd grade) I would fool around with girls, and flirt and kiss and try to “up my game”, and I would always think why not do both (be good with game and take the time to be smarter and learn a lot)? The guys that did the best in tests and were “intellectually gifted” like me in school would all be shit with girls; I never understood why they couldn’t go for both like I wanted to.

A relevant sidenote here I think is that the guys that get laid a lot tend to be smarter than average. And not just seducers but pornstars too I think (any guys that sleep with a lot of women in their life). I've seen interviews of porn guys (just out of random curiosity) and they tend to be really smart dudes James Deen, Ron Jeremy etc.. Why is that? My theory is that it’d be hierarchy of needs: a guy who can fulfill his basic need of getting laid to a really high degree will tend to be further up the pyramid than average Joe trying to text a girl and get a winky face reply back.

I think it’s important to keep in mind the “are you smart? Why it doesn’t matter” article’s ideas (that article helped me make a much-needed, crucial paradigm shift back when you wrote it) but with that in mind, why is it that you see few 98th/99th percentile IQ guys that are skilled with getting girls or interested in getting girls. The nerds at school would be shit at it and of the few entrepreneurial self-actualized friends I’ve made in the past months, they're either too busy with work to care or fine with having a good ideal girlfriend and ending it there (ie not obsessed with sleeping with tons of girls or picking through a thousand to find the few best ones).

And from there, a similar question can be asked of me: why couldn't I (and you Chase and few others fall into this role) work at becoming a high-level successful helping person, but do so with a monogamous wife or girlfriend? I ask myself this; at the end of the day, in the grand scheme of things, do the girls just end up being a big distraction?

It’s sort of like video games to me (which I quit a year ago): I love it and it feels so awesome but at the end of the day it's sort of time killed, if it's not adding to your life then it's taking away; most guys geared on success don't have this but we do, wouldn't it be better to just settle down? You’ve talked about how once you settle down, your competitive edge and building things and testosterone levels all sort of taper down, but many elite entrepreneurial guys are married and settled, maybe they made their biggest leaps before they settled down?

I’m not sure whether getting lots of girls does hold me back significantly or not from my work; but I feel whether it does or doesn’t, it’s in my nature. I was born to sleep with a lot of girls, and going out to meet a new girl when I’m horny is every bit of a carnal impulse of mine as getting up to make food when I’m hungry.

So sort of a skewed bunch of questions here, but curious on your thoughts as always.



Chase Amante's picture


It’s true; generally, the guys who do best with girls are above average in smarts. I’ve known a few who weren’t the sharpest tools in the tool shed, but even these guys had a good amount of subject area expertise… almost idiot savants in a way. When you get TOO intelligent, there’s a cap to how much time you’re going to devote to girls… after a while, there are just more interesting things to focus your attention on. Plenty of really brilliant guys have also done well with women, but it’s never their main thing, or never is for very long, like it is for some above average intellect guys, whose sole life’s purpose seems sleeping with as many women as is humanly possible.

It might have nothing to do with intellect and entirely be sex drive. e.g., I have an above average level of testosterone / sex drive, but it’s not CRAZY high; I’ve had some friends that are just horny constantly, and all they do is pick up and it never gets old for them. They just want their cocks in holes, and nothing else is as interesting to them as this. Some of them are really smart men, and some of them are on the duller side, but the thing they have in common is they all want sex, all the time.

Most highly successful men do seem to make their biggest leaps when they’re younger, or make the strides that set them up for outsized success when they’re younger. The make the revolutions when young, then settle down and use the stability to keep them working on those revolutions and nurturing them to their ultimate outsized ends. And the ones who keep making revolutions all seem to be philanderers and adulterers… so they’re still chasing tail despite being married, and the motivation to be impressive, puff their chests, and strut their stuff never quite leaves them.


Wolf's picture

Hey chase, i was on the forum and saw a post from you saying you see people from your past that live the same lives as they did in high school and college.

Can you explain that better to me? Do you mean they act the same, with the same spouse?

What can I do to not be stuck having the same life as I did in high school and college?

How can I make my life even better than it was back then as I get older and older? I feel like as I get older life doesn't matter as much and your past when you were young was the best.

I don't want to be one of those old men that drink and drink and just talk about the past and then killing himself because of it.


Chase Amante's picture


I mean still in the same places, still acting the same, looking the same, hanging out with the same people, doing the same kinds of things, working the same kinds of job. That’s a terrifying fate if you’re an ambitious person, but really, that’s life for most people and I’m probably being a little extreme by painting it as a “bad thing” - a lot of people aspire to live ordinary, hardworking lives of doing whatever it is they were raised to do in the same place they were raised to do it.

If you don’t want a life like that, then do what you DO want to do. If you have a thirst for adventure, then follow it. Try new things, meet new people, go new places. Spend your youth doing all those crazy things you’d like to look back on as an old man and say, “Ha! When I was a youngin’, I sure lived.”

On other questions-

I’d say anyone who’s 15+ years older than the girls he’s trying to sleep with is “older”, though of course it’s all semantics. How old “old” is to anyone is dependent on that person. To a 16-year-old high school girl who only interacts with people in her grade, an 18-year-old may be “old”; to a girl in her early 20s who routinely works around older higher ups at work, an attractive man in his 40s may still be quite young. If you’re a freelancer, then yes… it’s not stretching the truth too much I suppose to say you run your own business, even if the fact is that you are a business of one.

Your other questions are all, “Well, it depends,” questions. Can a guy who’s 50 years old but plays in a local band sleep with girls in their twenties? Well I suppose he can, yeah. How about a 55-year-old who’s in great shape and regularly goes surfing out at the shore? Yeah. How about a 60-year-old Navy Captain, like the one I talked about in that article? Absolutely. Depends on the girl, and depends on the man.

Now, if the question is, “Can a dumpy, unexceptional ordinary older man with nothing especially attractive or special about him sleep with loads of hot coeds?” the answer there is probably going to be “no”. If you want exceptional results, you must become exceptional yourself.


Anonymous's picture

Chase, I'm becoming impotent and I don't know why. I am not stressed and it's gotten weaker and weaker over the past months until almost completely soft. How many times a day is too much sex? I am very scared and this is not a joke.

Chase Amante's picture


Very frequently, this is psychological, in which case the best way to fix it is going to be to stop worrying about how hard your member is and to start focusing on the girl: "How to Get Turned On and Beat Performance Anxiety with New Girls."

If that's not enough though, it may be a medical issue, in which case you should definitely see a doctor. Sometimes problems with the heart or other circulatory system problems are the cause - take your flagpole refusing to sail at full mast as a potential sign of underlying physiological issues and get them checked out... it might be a warning that something else is wrong and needs fixing.


Wolf's picture

1.Thanks for all the advice Chase. When you talk about dating younger women what do you define as old when you say older man? Do you mean a 30-35 yr old trying to sleep with a girl who's 20? Or do you mean a guy who's 45 and up trying to get with a 20 year old girl?

2. Are you telling me that once you hit 30-35, you have to have wealth, retire, or be the boss to get girls and if you don't that's it? So, are you saying once you hit 30 and you don't have those things you won't get girls?

I feel 30's aren't too bad to sleep with younger girls, I feel once you're 40 and up you'll have to be extraordinary.

3.Can you explain the age differences to me?
Like how you say older man and younger girl. What is old to a younger girl and what is young to a older guy.

Im not talking about closeness in age like one might be 1 or 2 years. I mean if you're 30 and the girl is 25. Does that make you that old to her that you have to be retired or have your own business to date someone 5 years younger than you?

4. Do older guys have to date their own age and up if they are not retired or have their own business? Whats the youngest a guy can go his junior if he's a regular older man?

5.Can you get away with lying? Saying you have a business but you don't. You're just sleeping with girls not marrying them.

Or you have a business, but you also work. (Say if the business isn't making a lot of money).

If im a freelancer or graphic designer, does that mean I have my own business? Since im working for myself?

6.What are some businesses i can start that don't require a lot of money and have a higher success rate?

Thanks Chase

VonThaDon's picture

Sup Chase, I was reading the forums and I stumbled on a post where you wrote that you wanted to be an NBA star after high school. I really wanted to know what was your plan on doing it.

I want to know because I would love to play in the NBA and I know you had something up your sleeve. My problem is I really didn't like the sport until later in life after high school and correct me of im wrong, you had a late start as well.

I'm 6'2 and im very athletic and strong. There's a few people under my height that play on the team.

1.So what was your plan getting into the NBA if you never played in high school? Im assuming you were going to try out for your school team in college.

2. I have no experience except for playing at the playground and in rec leagues, that's all I got. I want to try out for my college. How do I not let the fact that I have never played organized ball effect me?

3. How do I get the coach to take me seriously? With my lack of experience? the coach asks for all of this information, like video footage and what positioned I played. I feel I won't get a shot if I tell him, I played playground and in rec league. What should I do?

4. Tryouts are later this year, whats should my plan to get better be? And how do I handle practice, getting better with girls, work, and school?

Thank you

Chase Amante's picture


Well, keep in mind, I was an 18-year-old kid who had no idea what he was going to do with his life and wasn't exactly an expert on finding success. So my whole plan then was, "Keep practicing my shots until I can make crazy impossible shots from all manner of distances, from very close to very far, while running, while falling, etc." So what ended up happening was that I could hardly pass or dribble to save my life, but I could hit some wild shots from weird places on the court, mainly because that was what I'd focused on learning. I hadn't had other people to play with to learn how to hold onto the ball or play well on a team, so I was middling at best at those. Once I was in school I started playing on teams as much as I could, and improved to a solid baseline there, but it would've taken years of work before I'd have been remotely worth considering for any serious college ball team... even the crappy one at my school.

I can't really advise you on a coach or tryouts - my advice there wouldn't be worth following, as it'd be nothing but speculation. Instead, I'd suggest you seek out guys who've already done it, and ask them what to do, or get a book on learning basketball by a great coach - there are several out there - and follow it religiously.


Anonymous's picture

Chase it may sound a little weird but the fact that summer is rolling around makes me feel a little down in the dump. It means a lot of time off work, free long and hot weekends and there's always me without much to do. I mean I have a lot of hobbies and things I'm learning but on such days you want to do something crazy, go places and I don't have friends to do such things with.
People usually go away with their partners abd all my life I havent had anybody to go on vacations with. I only had flings so nobody really steady I could travel with. I know there're loads if websites these days to join travellers but I tried a couple of times and I don't like the dynamics of groups. Especially well formed ones already.
I thought of posts on my fb that Im looking for holiday companion but I guess I may sound pathetic this way and it can harm my status.

One or two ppl can be perfect for me. Whats the best and the most effective way of finding a person. I think finding someone to travel is harder than nailing one night stand.
But I don't want to sit another at home watching the perfect weather out the window.
Is it a good idea to ask people round just directly do you want to go away together? How to avoid looking and sounding creepy?

Chase Amante's picture


Hmm, not something I've done before, so that's tough. I've always either had friends to travel with, or had people at my destinations, or been able to find people to meet up with if I wanted them. Or just traveled alone, which is fun in its own right.

If I had to do it, I think I'd start by just pinging my acquaintances to oversell a multi-week (or however long) trip to somewhere fun and exotic and see who's down. If no one is, I'd just head to a hostel somewhere in the first leg of my journey and see if anyone there was cool and willing to change plans and go somewhere else (or maybe they had a good itinerary and liked me enough to invite me to tag along).

If you're looking for a female travel companion in particular, it might be worth converting a one-night stand into a friend with benefits and then just inviting her when summer rolls around. As most friends with benefits are looking for any chance they can get to expand their time with you and roll things toward a relationship, you'll stand a good chance of getting a "yes" out of that, I'd think.


J $'s picture

Chase, I really don't like going on dates. I like girls coming over to my house and straight get to business. How do I just skip dates and have girls come straight to my house? Can you tell me how to get them to come over for a first date and how to run dates for a first date at my house and to sleep with them on the first date at my house?

Thanks Chase

Chase Amante's picture


Sure. Two steps:

  1. Be incredibly, undeniably, inescapably sexy
  2. Invite her over


On a more serious note, you CAN pull this off fairly often if your fundamentals are down, you're clearly not a boyfriend candidate, and you meet girls through social circle or build up a tremendous amount of rapport over phone calls first. I've seen guys who worked both angles quite well. At that point, the girl likes you a great deal and feels extremely comfortable with you, so all you have to do is say, "Hey, come on over to my place and let's hang out," and she'll say sure.


Anonymous's picture

Chase, firstly, I understand how and why plausible deniability when it comes to 'asking' a girl to go home with you is so important, but are there ever situations when it is fine to be blunt about it ie 'ets go chill at mine' etc? Like if you could tell the girl wanted you so badly.

Secondly, I was reading the comment section in another article and you were talking about older guys with younger girls and the general consensus around here from what I can tell is that to get younger girls you need to be a somewhat established and impressive as an older man.

I get that, I understand why when your older you need to be proven to be considered.

But, are you specifically talking about dating younger women or simply fucking them? Because in my experience many of my older friends in their late thirties to mid forties have an easy time seducing younger girls and getting them into bed, and we're talking girls in their early twenties.

I always put it down to looks, experience and manliness. My older friends just look more manly and seasoned, their skills are sharper and when they are with a girl things just seem smoother. These guys are not wealthy in anyway, or overly impressive aside from decent fundamentals.

So are we talking about dating women as opposed to simply seducing them for a casual fling? If not, I don't see how it's really possible to show and convince a girl that you are successful and special in a simple seduction window, you can't prove anything.

Obviously when it comes to dating there will inevitably exist that social stigma of older men, younger women and I can see here why it is important for a guy to be different or more special that his peers to kill the effect that social stigma has over the girls mind.

But, when we say 'proven' and 'established' are we strictly talking wealth? Or is it more about showing you are a man who lives his own life and attempts to create things and build things for himself, ie write a book, run a mildly successful but still growing business, travel the world etc? Obviously some of these qualities desirability will vary between individual girls - but is it more about showing your a man who tries to build things and live his life independently when it comes to setting you apart from your peers by proving you have overcome the herd.

Just trying to grasp what you mean by proven.

The way I see it, older men in many ways are more naturally desirable for women, it's just that unfortunate social stigma that gets in the way.

Thanks chase.

Chase Amante's picture


Absolutely - when a girl is very turned on you can be direct about what you want to do with her. I have friends that whisper girls things like, "I want to touch all over your body," or, "I want to take you right now," and then pull. The only risk factor here is, if she is only emotionally sold on you and not logically, and the "spell" breaks, you may have to do some major damage control. If she's super sold on you and that's not changing, or you're confident logistics won't be an issue, this is no problem. Also, if you're setting things up to reconnect with a girl later, this can be perfect, because if she's reconnecting with you you know what it's for.

The point about older men having to be established was primarily for dating. An older man can be quite sexy and still get laid no problem even if he doesn't have much money. This does get harder as he ages though... 35 to 45 is the sweet spot for a man's value as a mate, and it's never higher than this age range; afterwards, he'll tend to decline if he isn't exceptional both in appearance and in how well established he is. I would not be surprised to hear about a very attractive, very in-shape man in his 50s or 60s who still managed to sleep with young women without being financially or otherwise successful, though I imagine this is pretty rare, since most men motivated enough to look good and sleep with younger women by this age are also motivated enough to ensure a reasonable amount of success by then too.


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