Dale Carnegie's Most Life-Changing Piece of Advice


A little while back, when I was in my early 20s, I first read Dale Carnegie’s perennial bestseller How to Win Friends and Influence People. Many of the approaches described within it were things I knew, or affirmed what I felt, but sometimes the best kind of advice is this way; you think you’re doing things right, and then someone far more experienced than you comes along and says, “Yep, you’ve got it. In fact, take what you’re doing now and do it more.”

dale carnegie

Because it’s been nearly a decade since I’ve read it, most of its lessons have faded from my mind, and all I remember about it was one key lesson from it. However, that lesson has influenced how I’ve dealt with people in such a profound way that I don’t think I’ll ever forget it no matter how much time passes.

[edit: was rolling Napoleon Hill’s Laws of Success up as one of Carnegie’s works... forgive the brain fart]

Yet, pound-for-pound, the key takeaway from Win Friends and Influence People for me has been one of the best takeaways from any book I’ve yet read period.

Before I tell you what that is, let me tell you what I’ve noticed about how most people communicate with one another.


dale carnegie

I was in earshot once while in Asia of a friend’s phone conversation as she tried to negotiate with a landlord for an apartment she wanted to rent. She’d been shown a place by an agent who was going to charge her an upfront fee of $800, but she’d managed to get the landlord’s phone number to sign the lease with him directly instead, and bypass the agent.

(In some parts of Asia, real estate agents are so pervasive that it’s impossible to find an apartment without going through them; they spam-call owners trying to rent out their places until the owners finally relent because the only calls they get all day are agents’ calls, and they spam-list apartment listings with copied images onto the classifieds, so that even if you try to find an apartment on your own, all the numbers you’ll come up with are agents’, because the owners’ listings are quickly buried under the deluge of duplicate agent posts. So, most people feel no remorse about going around them if they can, since the agents themselves serve as highly unethical middlemen trying to carve out profit where there probably shouldn’t be nearly as much)

The landlord was happy to sign with my friend... but only if a chunk of those extra savings she afforded herself by getting around the agent were passed onto him in the form of higher rent.

 “That doesn’t make any sense!” my friend said. “I’m the one who was going to be paying the agent fee; it doesn’t have anything to do with you!”

 “The total amount you’re paying for the apartment goes down by cutting out the agent,” the owner said. “We need to distribute that fairly.”

 “The agent fee has nothing to do with you!” my friend replied, exasperated. “You didn’t have to pay anything! I’m the one who had to do all the work of running around the compound trying to find someone who had your phone number to contact you directly. I’m the one who took the initiative to find a way for us to sign an agreement without the middle man!”

 “All the same, it isn’t fair for you to save on the agent fee but I still charge a lower rent price,” said the landlord.

The two of them squabbled like this on the phone a little while longer, then hung up. The landlord had had his apartment on the market for 9 months and on the market it would remain; my friend found another apartment she liked more not long after, but not without having to run around more and get more frustrated first.

Yet, what I pointed out to her shortly after her phone call was this: neither of you handled that conversation well at all.


Alexander and Parmenio

When most folks communicate, their communication is all about themselves.

It’s primarily about things like this:

  • Here’s what I want
  • Here’s how hard I’ve worked
  • Here’s how much I deserve this
  • Here’s what I’m going to do if I don’t get it

That wouldn’t be so much of a problem, except that most of the time, you end up with two people telling each other what each of them wants.

But when all you’re talking about is what you want, and all I’m talking about is what I want, we very quickly find ourselves at an impasse.

There’s an old rebuttal in English, not used so much anymore, that goes like this:

You are thinking of Parmenio, and I of Alexander.

The saying relates to a story about Parmenio, right-hand man to both Alexander the Great and his father before him, Phillip II of Macedon, who was telling Alexander what he felt he ought to receive, while Alexander was busy thinking of what he ought to give him.

dale carnegie

Those might sound like the same thing, but they’re actually very different.

The first is thinking, “I’ve worked so hard / deserve this so much – here’s what you should give me!”

The other is thinking, “Well, here’s the value this individual is providing to me – here’s what I should give him.”

It’s important to note the main difference here: what and how people value things is always, always, always DIFFERENT for every individual. And most people do not realize this at all.

Let me give you some examples.


Valuation Differences in Negotiations

One of the discussions I’ve had repeatedly with writers for Girls Chase has been article length and pay rate.

When you’re a writer, your product is your writing. When you write more of it, you want to be paid more. It’s pretty natural and intuitive from the writer’s perspective to assume that more work should = higher pay. Right? That just makes sense.

Yet, from a business point of view, longer articles do NOT = more revenue for Girls Chase.

I spent about a year writing super-long articles, in part because I wanted to, but also in part as an experiment. “If I write 5,000- to 10,000-word articles, do they perform 2.5 to 5x as well as 2,000-word ones?” I was curious to know. I thought that they would.

After a year of that experiment, I looked at the data, and came away with some interesting takeaways: longer articles do perform slightly better than shorter ones, but on a scale of quickly diminishing returns.

In other words, paying someone twice as much for an article that’s twice as long doesn’t make good business sense.

But if you’re a writer, writing 4,000 words really is twice as much work as writing 2,000 words. The amount of time you put in doesn’t shrink as you go along. It’s just as much work. So if you write more, you want just as much pay.

Therefore, one of the conversations I’ve ended up having several times with various people has been that of, “Much as I would love to, I can’t pay you more for longer articles without breaking the bank... because they don’t earn more for the business.”

Seems simple enough when you put it that way, but if I didn’t realize I needed to communicate like this, a writer would simply ask, and I would refuse, and they’d think I was being unreasonable for not being willing to pay more for their hard work and I’d think they were being unreasonable for trying to suck the lifeblood out of me for no extra value to the business and we’d both go away feeling resentful toward one another.

I have a very strong suspicion that 95% of labor union disputes occur solely because of a lack of communication between the business and the workers about what value their work provides to the business and what else they can do to generate more value if they want to earn higher pay.

Here’s another example of values crisscrossing.

We recently had a guy write in to announce that he would NEVER pay for information, and therefore never would subscribe to this website or buy one of the programs here, however, he’d like to cut a deal: he’d noticed a number of grammar errors and typos on various articles, and he’d be willing to go through and clean these up in exchange for unlimited access to the site.

Sounds like a good deal, right?

But here’s the thing: he started off his email by saying he’d never pay for what I’ve been working on full-time for the past 3 years or so. So emotionally, he’s already told me my work isn’t as valuable to him as, say, a Starbucks coffee or a new pillowcase for his pillow. That doesn’t really put me in the most receptive of moods.

Next, I’ve trained multiple editors to work on this site. It took me 8 months and 5 editors to find one we could stick with. Why’d it take so long? Because when you’re dealing with the nuances of social dynamics at an expert level, which is a very sensitive topic, 99% of editors out there do not realize the importance of how things are phrased in articles, and make little tweaks that alter the entire tone of a piece. Eventually I came across a pretty sharp editor, and then devoted a fair bit of time to working hands-on with him to help him figure out what to edit and what to not edit in articles to get to the point where he wasn’t doing the same kind of over-editing that had plagued all our previous editors (and that he’d started off doing as well), and now we’re in good shape.

So now, the very first thing I think about when someone tells me he wants to edit is, “Ugh... another month of critiquing and training and providing lots of feedback, and he may not even work out.”

And there’s another thing. It’s one you quickly learn when you run a business. Bringing people in to do things for privileges rather than pay that aren’t inherently enjoyable has an extremely high attrition rate.

A guy may start out thinking, “No problem – I’ll edit 6 articles a week and have unfettered access to the site,” but once he starts editing and realizes what a slog it is, then he starts wanting to get paid, or his motivation dries up.

 “But he’s getting site access!” you might say. “Surely that’s pay enough!”

Ah – but he’s already shown us that emotionally, he doesn’t value the information on the site enough to pay for it. It’s essentially value-less to him. So he offers his labor to get access, but once he HAS access his desire to do labor will vanish extremely fast. It’s something I’ve seen happen several times, and it’s a very predictable pattern. People only work for future rewards – if you’ve already received the reward (e.g., “Well, I’ve GOT access”), the motivation to keep doing high-concentration work like editing goes away very quickly.

I might’ve been able to train the fellow up and get more of my money’s worth of editing out of him than I’d have received from an average subscription from him... but it’d also have sucked up a lot of my time and focus training him and managing him and staying on top of him to make sure he was doing his edits and not slacking off because he’d already gotten his reward and there were no more coming.

In the end, he no doubt felt like he was making a generous offer and I’m some sort of robber baron for wanting to charge for the information I have to offer, while I felt like the deal I was being offered in exchange devalued the learning I’ve spent years and years accumulating, codifying, and making understandable to others wasn’t a good one to take.

And this is what happens in normal people negotiations.

Including in your relationships and when you are trying to convince women to do what you want – it’s the same thing with everyone you interact with.


dale carnegie

What’s the inherent flaw in all the communication/negotiation examples above?

Assumptions. Assumptions about what the other side wants, how it must value things, and how it will respond to value offerings:

  1. My friend assumed the landlord would realize she’d done all the work to skirt the agent fee, and happily sign the contract with her directly at no extra cost

  2. The landlord assumed my friend realized that he’d set his rental price at the price he had, and not higher, because he was assuming that any renter he took on would be paying an agent’s fee, and without that fee he’d want his “non-discounted” rent

  3. Parmenio assumed that because he’d done whatever he’d done, he should be able to demand what he saw as a fair price for his deeds

  4. Alexander assumed that Parmenio should accept whatever he felt worth offering to him, and that Parmenio should understand that the value of his deeds ought to be determined by the one paying for them, rather than the one doing them

  5. The fellow offering to trade his proofreading and editing skills in exchange for site access assumed that I’d be able to just plug him in and he’d be off to the races editing and cleaning up articles, providing some great value in exchange for a free subscription

  6. The writers assumed that by writing more, they should be paid more

Now here’s the thing: all of these assumptions are perfectly reasonable.

All of them.

Every single one.

Even if all of them are also incomplete, and completely miss the other side’s ability to capture value from the offer... because they only take one side of the negotiation into consideration.


What Carnegie Knew

Carnegie shared a story about a man who wanted to cut a deal with a successful businessman. I don’t remember the exact tale; it’s been a long while since I read it. The businessman had a reputation for being a hard case who shot down just about any offer that came his way.

The other man went into the businessman’s office, and for the first hour, all he did was listen to the businessman and tell the businessman about that businessman’s own business and interests and desires and goals. In other words, he spent an hour deep diving him about his business.

Then, only when he felt certain he knew the businessman’s goals, wants, desires, and ambitions inside and out did he propose his own offer, and tell the businessman how his offer was going to help the businessman reach his own objectives.

By that point, the businessman so trusted him and felt so understood that he could easily see the value in the other man’s proposal, and that other man walked out of there with a contract in hand that made him his fortune.

When I read this anecdote, I thought it was an interesting and valuable one, and then I filed it away mentally and thought to myself, “If ever I find myself in a hard business negotiation, I’ll pull this one out.”

Yet, over the years, I found myself pulling it out more and more for not business negotiations, but for any kind of misunderstanding I ran into.

dale carnegie

Any time where I found myself trying to explain something to one person, and they weren’t getting it, and they were trying to explain something to me, and I was thinking they were nuts, I’d circle back to this and realize, “We’re talking past each other. Each of us is so busy trying to tell the other what he wants that neither of us is serving as bridge-builder here.”

And so, rather than standing stubbornly in place and insisting on my way of seeing things, I began to build bridges every time I ran into these straits instead.


How Bridge-Building Works

The process of bridge building is simple... provided you can override your own natural urge to blurt out your own point and trample the other person’s.

It works like this:

  1. Start off every argument, disagreement or negotiation by seeking to understand the other side first. Before you start talking about what you want, as soon as you realize that you and the other person are not 100% on the same page, it’s time to set aside what you want and focus entirely on what the person you’re talking with believes and what he’s trying to achieve.

  2. Focus on things that don’t make sense to you. Rather than look for common ground, start digging into why the other person thinks the way he does and believe the thing he does and values what he values as he does. Why’s it so important? Get to the root cause – you won’t be able to deal with him at all until you do.

  3. Feed back his root causes to him. Before you start talking about you, you need to make sure he knows that you get him through and through. This means feeding back his core feelings, emotions, and values to him so that he understands that you understand.

  4. Only then do you focus on explaining your root causes to him. Now that you know why the things that are important to him, before you talk about specific things you want, you need to talk root causes. That is, explain your underlying value system to him, and why it’s important.

  5. Next, state the specifics of what you want. Now you can talk details on what YOU want.

  6. Finally, tie your wants to his wants. The last thing you do is to say, “Here’s how what I want can work together with what you want so that we can both get what we want.”

That’s the abstract. Now let me give you an example.


Example Bridge-Building

Let’s say you’re fighting with your girlfriend. She’s angry because you had a night out on the town with the boys last night; you’re annoyed because she’s trying to control you.

Now, you can either yell at each other, or you can get to the root of it.

Quit talking about what you want (for her to stop trying to control you) and start figuring out what she wants... because you can bet that your first instinct (”She wants to control me!”) probably isn’t 100% on the money.

It’ll go like this:

You: Okay, so you’re angry with me because I went out drinking with my friends last night.

Her: No, it’s fine.

You: ... and you think that I’m going to meet some other girl and start dating her and break up with you. So you don’t want me to go to make sure you can hang onto me.

Her: No, that’s not it at all!

[Focusing first here on the thing that doesn’t make sense to him (why does she care about this so much?). Since she isn’t forthcoming with her reasons, you list out what YOU think she cares about (you tell her your assumptions), and let her tell you if they’re right or wrong]

You: Well then what is it?

Her: It’s that we haven’t been spending that much time together, and I thought we were going to spend Thursday night together like usual, and then suddenly you just said sorry, can’t, I’m going out with my friends. And I was like, “Am I even still in a relationship anymore?”

You: Ah, so that’s it then – you’ve been feeling like we haven’t been spending enough time together, and then I suddenly canceled on a night you’d be planning to spend with me, and it felt like I was just pulling away from you more and more, so you got upset.

Her: I just feel like you haven’t been as close recently.

[Here you’ve gotten to the root of her feelings, and fed them back to her. She’s agree with you that you understood her correctly]

You: All right, that makes sense. And I can’t speak to a general trend you’ve been sensing – we’d have to sit down and look at how much time we’ve been spending together and if that’s been going down. Last night in particular one of my buddies was in town and it was the only night that I could have seen him.

Her: I understand that; I want you to meet your friends. It’s good to have friends.

You: I appreciate that. And for my part, I probably should’ve given you more notice that I wouldn’t be able to see you Thursday, even if that isn’t something we have set in stone... we’ve been seeing each other there regularly enough that it’s become kind of a routine, and almost an implicit thing on the schedule.

Her: I mean, it’s fine, I just...

[You’ve skipped discussing the root here that you don’t want to be controlled because it wasn’t necessary in this case – she isn’t trying to control you. Instead, you went straight to specifics, discussing why the prior night played out the way it did]

You: No, I should’ve given you a heads up. I’ll be more considerate of implicit schedules in the future and notify you more in advance if I think I need to bend or break them.

Her: Okay. You know, it’s okay, I feel fine now.

[Now you provide a solution that meets both of your needs – you’ll still have your freedom to do what you want, so long as you ping her in advance, and she won’t feel slighted by you so long as you’re showing her that you care by showing some consideration toward you. If you actually have been spending less time on her and want to remedy that, you might also propose having a special day or chunk of time during the week that is your time with her]

You: You just needed to affirm that I still cared, right?

Her: No, that’s not it... I just... it’s fine. I’m okay now.

You: Well, I think that’s what it was, at least subconsciously, and now that you’ve seen that I do you feel okay again.

Her: That might be it.

... and the end part here is a bit more wrap up on the psychological back end if you feel like going the extra mile and reinforcing that you REALLY get what she’s all about (she just wanted to feel like you cared).


You Should Use This with Everything

Adopting this style has changed the way I communicate with people across the board for the better.

You must be patient though – I’ve interacted with people who try to use this style, but then seize on the first reason you provide before you’re finished providing it and begin tackling that as their, “Ah ha! Now I get you!” reason for understanding you, even as you struggle to say, “No, you don’t have the full picture – you still don’t get it,” and they just plow ahead with their incomplete picture of what you’re after and it ends up not working and you still both end on opposite sides of the table. You’ve really got to carefully get down to the heart of the matter, or this is still useless.

The key to this style is getting others to understand you by first understanding them. There are some types it doesn’t work on – cluster B and low / no empathy individuals are immune to this, because no matter how well you show them you understand them, they will never put themselves in your shoes to understand you empathetically – and for those types, really the only thing you can do is lure them in with things they want or bludgeon them into accepting your frames.

But for people who are willing to see your side IF you see theirs FIRST – and that’s 95% of people out there – this works some absolute magic.

It’s simple enough to learn. Just focus on making it that the moment you realize you’re in a disagreement and neither of you is convincing the other, stop trying to disagree, because you’re obviously getting nowhere...

... and instead, focus on finding out what the other person’s core values are and WHY this thing is so important to them / they must do things the way they feel they must do things.

Once you understand them, what seemed like senseless behavior to you will at once make all the sense in the world... and they will then almost always be willing to listen to your side of the coin, and do so with an empathetic ear that will want to get you on the same page as them as well.

If you want to have your cake with other people and eat it to, this is the simplest, most consistent, and best way to do it.

And while I’m sure there’ve been plenty of people who’ve pieced it together themselves throughout human history, I, for one, have Dale Carnegie to thank for it – among a lot of other great lessons. So here’s to Dale.

Chase

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Comments

Anonymous's picture

The Laws of Success


Hi Chase,

Great article as always, I've been trying to find a reference to The Laws of Success, do you have a link you could share?

Chase Amante's picture

Reference to Laws of Success

Author

Anon-

You mean sort of a Cliff's Notes version? I'm afraid I don't know any of these - I have it on audio, and give it a listen every so often when I feel I could use a refresher. But it's a pretty popular book - I'm sure there are student or teacher notes on it out there if you search.

Chase

Anonymous's picture

Chase!


Before I read any further... the "Law of Success" is by Napoleon Hill, not Carnegie. I know because you recommended it to us! Was a great book indeed. Ok now back to the article...

Chase Amante's picture

Errata

Author

Thanks Anon. I perpetually get the two men confused... no idea why. Misattributing one man's book to another man's name has been something I've done time and again with those two. Cheers for pointing that one out soon after this hit the presses! All fixed now.

Chase

Sam2's picture

Deep Dive: A magic wand or just a screening tool?


Chase,

It is really fascinating how simple ideas like understanding one another can be so difficult to be implemented in every-day life interactions. Great article!

Is it, however, possible that you deep dive, understand, and empathise with a girl and yet fail to come to favourable terms with her in the end? Especially during the initial stages of meeting her let's say you deep dive her and you see she wants a boyfriend and you want just sex; how does understanding her needs (i.e. she wants boyfriend) help you get what you want?

To put in other terms, is it possile that deep dive is not a way to proselytise her to your own desires, but merely a screening tool that allows you to know which girls want the same as you? You can't possibly give every girl you meet boyfriendship, just because you understood it is what she wants from you, nor is it possible to lure every girl towards a passionate one night stand with you and lead her to abandon her own desires (i.e. boyfriendship), can you?

Chase Amante's picture

No Common Ground

Author

Sam-

Sure, it's possible; it's more likely when your fundamentals are still rough around the edges, or you've fumbled the ball somewhere earlier in the interaction and made her stop seeing you as a potential lover.

Most women willing to consider you as a boyfriend would also be willing to consider you as a lover if you kicked things off right with them and not made mistakes, but getting good with girls is somewhat a process of learning how to kick things off right and not make a mistake that sinks you.

So, you'll certainly have interactions where it's clear the only thing you want from her is a fling and it's clear the only thing she wants from you is MAYBE a relationship (or maybe just friends).

If she DEFINITELY wants you as a boyfriend you'll have wiggle room, because she likes you a lot and may compromise on her stance if it's going to advance her overall goal; if she only kinda sorta wants that from you though, and isn't interested in you sexually, deep diving might help you find out more about her as a person but it probably isn't going to make her change her mind.

Chase

xIRONCROSSx's picture

Hey Chase, Great message


Hey Chase,
Great message you're sending here. Curious if you've ever read any of Dr. John Gray's stuff such as Men Are From Mars, Women Are From Venus , but this is the same style of communication discussed throughout Dr. Gray's book as well.

One thought I've had around this style of communication is in approaches and speaking to women in general. I feel like employing this all of the time (very empathetic) will cause instant friend zone in many situations because it may lead to becoming an 'emotional tampon' in a sense.

Would you say that this style of communication--deep diving to truly understand root beliefs, the hows and whys of what people think (aka the girl you are talking to) --should be like a switch to be turned on/off at different times? Or is this a style that you encourage throughout all of your interactions?

On a different note,
You and the GC team post some fantastic articles on here man! I want to make a special note about the start of this particular article:


Many of the approaches described within it were things I knew, or affirmed what I felt, but sometimes the best kind of advice is this way; you think you’re doing things right, and then someone far more experienced than you comes along and says, “Yep, you’ve got it. In fact, take what you’re doing now and do it more.”

I think this hammers straight home with a lot of guys who are (like myself) still finding ourselves flailing at times and need a little reassurance that we aren't always doing things completely wrong...a bit of encouragement never hurt anyone right?

You and your team's articles greatly reinforce this "Yep you've got it" message, which is something everyone needs, even the manliest of men. You guys give us a much needed light to help guide us on, not only our relationship paths, but our paths in life as well.

Keep up the great work!

-M

Chase Amante's picture

Off and On

Author

M-

Glad to hear it on the reassurance! I think if you have a half-decent social awareness, a lot of this stuff you know at SOME level, but mixed messages from media, the people around you, second-guessing yourself because of inexperience and not enough past results to know for sure whether a thing works or not, etc., cloud your confidence in these. Much of upgrading yourself socially is pushing the cloud away.

Re: John Gray - can't say I have read any of his stuff, no. I've certainly heard of it though... Men are from Mars was all over the airwaves for quite a long time when it first came out!

On when to use this - yes, definitely turn it on for negotiations, but not other places. Normal conversation should be a mixture of small talk, getting-to-know-you stuff, and banter or flirting, depending on who it is, what your objective is, and how well/long you've known the person. Doing this ALL the time will just make you sound wonky and over-analytical ;)

Chase

Anonymous's picture

Stephen Covey, author of 7


Stephen Covey, author of 7 Habits of Highly Effective People, has a similar take on this:

Seek first to understand then to be understood.
Think win-win.

I've of course listed only 2 of the 7 Habits he epouses in his book. The great avatars of history invariably arrive at similar conclusions that Carnegie and Amante did.

Anonymous's picture

This is one of my favourite articles


Chase, I just want you to know how appreciated this article is, I too have read HTWF&IP and it's a great read.

This article has really cleared up how effective this is and made it super easy to understand.

Funnily enough I could have done with reading this article about 3 hours ago. Thankfully though I have learnt enough to do a pretty good job and did pretty much what this article says just not quite as eloquently as I would have done had I just read this :)

More articles like this please, anything that helps in all aspects of life and makes us attract and KEEP more attractive people into our lives is highly welcomed (one thing I love about this site is it's not purely for beginners like most seem to be aimed toward).

Using this as an opportunity to put my site out there while I'm here, hope you don't mind.
http://www.ideabubbles.wordpress.co.uk
(It's a collection of my thoughts and ideas on all things like; football, politics and business.)

Anonymous's picture

what you've implemented as a


what you've implemented as a scenario conversation is fantastic.

well-written although i think theres lots more to carnegie's book

tommy321's picture

Path to Success


Chase ,how do you continue on your path to success
when you face small failures? In my case, it is cold approach.
I know for sure that at start it will be hard and eventually get better with
time but seriously....at times I do feel like just giving up and think that I will
never get good. Any techniques on how to keep going in front and really reach success in spite of the small failures?

Chase Amante's picture

Re: Path to Success

Author

Tommy-

See this article - sounds like it's just what you need: "Dealing with Failure: An Important Learning Tool."

Chase

hrkwm's picture

Chase,my friend, I am facing


Chase,my friend, I am facing a problem.
You see, in my family and the society I live in,
when you don't marry you are perceived as someone who turned bad.
I am afraid of deceiving my family by not marrying. Elders told me
that other young people like me didn't marry and ended up regretting it
during the rest of their lives. What should I do? If I do not marry, will
I regret it or not?

Chase Amante's picture

Not Marrying

Author

Hr-

I'm afraid I can't really be much help here - I don't know what culture you're in, what it's like there, how old you are, whether you plan to marry later, what your reasons are for not marrying, etc.

I can say however that of my friends from marriage cultures, many of them used to be hounded by elders to marry even when they were quite young (a Chinese friend of mine had his grandmother hounding him at 23, telling him that when SHE was 23, she already had two children!), and put it off for a while but eventually married anyway.

Chances are, unless you're pushing 50 and not among the exceptional men we discussed in "Attracting and Dating Younger Women", there's not really a huge rush and you will find a girl you want when you want her.

In my experience, most young men are certain they will never marry, only for them to end up mostly all married somewhere between 30 and 45 anyway.

Chase

Moon's picture

That hit the spot. that's


That hit the spot. that's exactly what i've been reading a while now in a negotiation book "getting to yes", by the way one of the greatest books I have red.
There's another book which advocate the same, but in a more spiritual way "The 4 agreements" by Don Miguel Ruiz.
Chase, I have a suggestion that might inspire you for some future article : "how the philosophy of "don't take anything personally" can help in advancing in social life and seduction".

Chase Amante's picture

"Don't Take Anything Personally"

Author

Thanks Moon - great recommendations, and great topic suggestion. I'll add it to the queue.

Chase

Anonymous's picture

Power Struggles


Hey Chase this is a great article. Could you do an article about how to handle power struggles in friendships? I find it really has to do with investment. For example, my friend wants me to meet him somewhere, but I want him to meet me. Its like five minutes away, but its a power struggle thing. I get really annoyed when people do this because I'd like to have friends who don't try to make things a competition like this. But I also have learned from this site that everyone is like this. Can you help me out?

Chase Amante's picture

Power Struggles

Author

Anon-

I could probably do one on power struggles in general - it's the same whether it's a friend, a family member, a romantic partner, etc. All the same cause - someone thinks you hold the upper hand, but doesn't respect you enough to believe you should continue to hold it instead of them holding it.

Ricardus and Eric each have articles up on this phenomenon already here though - worth reads: "Relationship Control and Female Domination" & "How to Power Shift with Social Cunning and Savvy."

Chase

The M's picture

Other people's arguments, your example


Hi Chase,

Thanks for this article - I haven't read the book, but it's nice to see your favorite part expounded upon here.

I was wondering what you do when two other people are having this kind of impasse in their argument and the outcome affects you. Do you try to mediate? Try to get them to follow Carnegie's advice? Try to lead them?

Also, in your example with your girlfriend, she said, "It's fine. I just...", but then it felt like that part never got resolved, and her "That might be it" at the end didn't seem very definitive. So that ending didn't quite click with me, but obviously her non-verbals, etc. could have been saying something completely different, so I wanted to know if I was missing something there.

Thanks!

Best,
The M

Chase Amante's picture

Others' Arguments, Unresolved Business

Author

M-

I've spent a lot of time playing peacemaker, and the conclusion I ultimately came to is that you do NOT get involved in other people's arguments. Let them bash each other to death, and after it's all said and done once you're one-on-one with one of them you can provide some reflection and point out errors in their logic you noticed, but don't get in the middle of something. All that ends up happening is you delay their explosion, thereby making it a stronger one later.

On the dialogue - you're right; I was a bit too hasty in writing this one up!

If a girl's saying, "I just..." and trailing off, you want to tackle that one and pull it out of her: "No, wait - just what? Just what? I'm not a mind reader, you have to tell me. If you don't tell me, it doesn't get resolved. If you don't tell me, you're just going to bring it up again later and we'll fight about it then," and just keep throwing reasons at her until she tells you - at that point, you're free to bring it to resolution.

Chase

Bolt's picture

Great Stuff


You know, I left a comment in regards to Carnegie on your April 1st post. I don't know if you saw it or if something else triggered this article, but anyways, great stuff; this is definitely one of your best. You know, I'm still confused about how to use Carnegie's principles in an interview where the interviewer is usually in control of the conversation. If you never get to this comment or the last one doesn't matter, still an excellent and much appreciated post! Really glad I found this site, peace.

Chase Amante's picture

Interviews

Author

Bolt-

Hmm, I might've missed that one on the April 1st piece. On interviews... hard for me to say. I've spent much more time as interviewer than I have as interviewee, so I can't really say, "Here's how I ace interviews," very honestly, because while I have aced a few, I've also mucked up a bunch more.

I can say that as interviewer, when an interviewee clearly tries to take the power away from you, they basically lose any chance of you hiring them because it's just a complete turn off (or at least that's my reaction... it's "Okay, obviously this person has no respect for me as a superior, which means our entire course of working together would be one long, continuous, extremely pointless and petty power struggle - no thanks").

Maybe the best way I can think of is if an interviewee sat and patiently answered all my questions as interviewer, then used his chance to ask his own questions as an opportunity to find out a lot about the organization and then stitch that back to his qualities and present how great a fit he is. The (relatively few) times I succeeded as an interviewee I did something like this, or else had already done a lot of homework on the company and my answers to my interviewers' questions already incorporated this - I'd answer by saying, "Well, one of the things COMPANY X focuses on in its mission statement is Y VALUE, and this is a big one for me too - I..." e.g., try to educate the interviewer on the company's own values and operations with your answer, while tying yourself in, and you're a shoe-in.

Chase

Anonymous's picture

great article. i especially


great article. i especially appreciate how you added a disclaimer regarding personalities this would not work on. i find that many people don't try to or care to understand my pov. it's like the situation when you're talking to your parents and nothing you say will ever register with them. i will make the effort to understand them and explain myself but after thinking they've empathized with me i find out everything i've said basically went in one ear and out the other. in these cases it's almost like you can skip the explaining of your own values because they don't care anyway. but i digress...

i've been talking to a lot of customer service reps/managers lately, and in these situations, there usually isn't anything I can offer them. it's usually i want this or i deserve this because you guys screwed up, after pointing out how I understand that mistakes happen or what not of course. what can we do in situations where an exchange of value isn't practical or the servicer isn't interested in providing good service? or a simple situation when you want someone to do a favor for you?

Chase Amante's picture

Customer Service Reps

Author

Anon-

Yeah, no fun when what you're saying is in one ear and out the other. Much of the time that's a sign you need to tweak your communication, but sometimes there really just isn't anything you can do because the other person just doesn't see you as someone they need to listen to at all and isn't going to open up enough to you to let you change that perspective for them.

Customer service reps the best thing to start off with usually is something along the lines of, "Hey, I really love PRODUCT X and have had an amazing experience with it so far. I'm having an issue with XYZ thing - can you help me? How can we straighten this out?"

When someone feels like you're excited about what they offer and find value in what they do and offer, they'll tend to feel like you and they are on the same "team", and will want to bend over backward to help you.

When you approach it like most people do, which is with either a, "Hey, you guys messed up and now you need to fix this," attitude that makes the rep go on the defensive and become combative, or a, "Hello... I'm just a random person, can you help me?" attitude that make the rep feel like this is just another person asking for a handout of time and support, you'll either get a fight (with the former) or the bare minimum of support (with the latter).

So, err on the side of showing solidarity with the business first and communicating that you're a big fan, then ask for what you need after.

Chase

Sajid's picture

Dealing with Cluster-B women


Dear Chase,

Really good advise by Mr. Carnegie and thank you for bringing it to us. In your article you wrote this regarding dealing with cluster-b women: "really the only thing you can do is lure them in with things they want or bludgeon them into accepting your frames". Can you please elaborate this with some situational examples (perhaps you can use same girl in this article as an example) ?

Regards
Sajid

Chase Amante's picture

Dealing with Cluster-B women

Author

Sajid-

This is a good reference on this: "Dating Narcissistic and Egotistical Women."

Using the girl in the article as an example, if she's cluster B and she suspects you of something, you can spend all day and night explaining yourself to her until you're blue in the face and she still won't buy it, so it isn't worth trying. What you do with these girls is just lay out straight boundaries, like, "Okay, look: I really like you, but I need to be able to see my friends too and if you try to cut me off from them this relationship's going to reach its terminus pretty fast." Essentially what you do there is tap into their paranoia: what's the bigger fear, that you're cheating or that they're going to corner you into a breakup with their actions? Usually it's the latter, and they'll back down and put a lid on it.

The simplest way of putting it is that you just have hard rules, and rather than try to understand a low empathy person and get her to see your side, you just explain things to her once - extremely briefly - then assume she's not going to believe you anyway and just let her know how it's going to be. She can take it or leave it; if she's otherwise happy with the relationship she will always take it.

Chase

Sajid's picture

Thanks


I appreciate your reply Chase. Thank you very much.

Regards,
Sajid

Anonymous's picture

timing for making a move


Hey chase,
This site has certainly helped me leaps and bounds. Nowadays i always find myself chatting with hot and beautiful girls without me even realising it. But there is a sticking point rather a glich and am sure its one of the biggest sticking points for most beginners. It is when to make a move. Which situations are a go go and which are not. Is it about timing . What are the things you talk about just prior or how do you get to a state of making a move without being overtly obvious?How to close in the proximity ? Because afterall making a move is the final key right? You have mentioned it in the articles for escalation windows and sexual tension and escalation time and again , but i think the importance of this topic in the final seduction it might need an article of its own?

Chase Amante's picture

Re: timing for making a move

Author

Anon-

Hmm, yeah, the nuts and bolts specifics on that one are a little hard to break down at first blush. Very instinctual. A big one is when conversation dies down and she's just staring at you, of course (and you can somewhat make this happen on your own, too); other details like drooping eye lids and smaller, sexier smiles (as opposed to broad excited / friendly ones), or her switching into bedroom voice are all dead giveaways; many girls will arc their backs and stick out their chests more fully, etc.

Anyway, I will jot it down for a proper article and see what kinds of details I can come back with!

Chase

Anonymous's picture

Books


Hi Chase,

It would be great if you could make a list of books that you recommend reading.

Cheers,

DjCozy

Troy's picture

Re: Books


DJ Cozy -

Check out this article on Girls Chase below with a bunch of books for reading more:

Recommended Reading

mr rob's picture

Christianity and sex before marriage


Hello Chase, not too long ago you wrote a very intriguing and controversial reply to a fellow commenter. I don't remember the article or your the exact response but I think it went like this.

The guy was talking about how he wants to learn seduction but it conflicts with his core beliefs since he was a Christian.

You replied that nowhere in the bible does it say you can't have sex before marriage and that you think he ought to do some soul searching and research to finish piecing in his core beliefs before diving head first into a conflicting beliefs. That being worshipping false idols vs. God, in biblical terms.

I found that such a profoundly controversial thing to say. I mean we as Christians are spoon fed from birth that we aren't supposed to have sex before marriage and most all of us accept it as truth without even looking into it. I mean God have mercy on us for being such sheep!

My question is first off, out of curiosity, how much of the bible have you read/researched to come to that conclusion? I know you've used Jesus as an example multiple times when describing strong character traits to emulate, so I assume you've have read the gospel. And given your wisdom you display on a regular basis I'm sure you've taken note of proverbs.

When I saw that comment I went into further study of the bible to sex before marriage, but as it's rather long and a bit dry it's hard to know where to look to come to my own conclusions. Any suggestions here?

So far I've come to the conclusion that sexual immorality is extremely ambiguous and open to interpretation, though fornication isn't.

Based on science and real life facts I've also come to the conclusion that sex is a healthy need of body and brain and that it wouldn't make sense for God to give us such STRONG sex drives only for them to be repressed until we for sure find the "perfect partner" (who knows how long that could take).

Also like you note, relationships are like pottery. Easy to mold in the beginning but once they set the dynamics are hard to change.

Wouldn't it be WISE to learn how to properly run a relationship prior to marriage so that the woman you choose to spend the rest of your life with in holy matrimony has all her needs met along with the best relationship possible (along with both parties not having to figure out how to give the woman multiple orgasms and great sex).

Also the amount of growth I've gone through (largely due to your website) in the past year and 3 months would never have occurred if I abstained from sex. Thank you for your ministry by the way in those regards, I don't believe I've personally thanked you.

God continues to bless me on a daily basis and I think I've grown closer to him in the process of all this sexual personal growth, oddly enough.

Not trying to expound all my thoughts and cognitive dissonance right here but I would graciously appreciate your feedback into how you came to your conclusions on sex and Christianity as I've had a lot of conflicting beliefs in that past on this subject. Though I've been ironing them out to be less conflicting I'm still in search of the truth.

Now that I think about it this article, interestingly enough, kind of goes right up that alley.

Lastly I want to say this article was written extremely well. I think perhaps you've leveled up recently in your writing abilities (I'm sure writing a couple million words will do that too you).

This article in particular captured my attention immediately and kept intriguing me to read on. The stories in it were easy to relate to and kept things from becoming trite. The breakdown and examples were spot on.

Perfect material for my dad to look over, though unfortunately I think it would have been of better use to him 5 years ago than today... but hell better late than never.

Keep up the good work this place is looking rad.

p.s. Edit? I pressed send and thought I could revise it so if there are two of these comments use this one. That is all

Chase Amante's picture

Re: Christianity and sex before marriage

Author

Mr. Rob-

I was raised a Roman Catholic, so just about the strictest of Christians outside of some fundamentalist sects, and I don't do anything half-assed so I was about one of the most devout you'd find. One thing I *did* always struggle with was the no-sex-before-marriage thing; I've read more or less the entire Bible, and I realized after a while that neither Jesus nor any of the prophets of the Old Testament come out and forbid pre-marital sex. They're against homosexuality, and they're against "sexual immorality" (which isn't really defined), but the instructions to avoid fornication stem entirely from the religions they inspired (read: other men who came after them) rather than the original teachers themselves (although there are some parts of the Old Testament specific to women; see Deuteronomy 22:20-21 on that; neither Testament generally places restraints on straight men's sexuality, outside of vague immorality warnings in the Epistles).

Personally, my philosophy is, unless a follower is producing his own original teachings in addition to the message he carries forward, and these teaching have themselves been weighed by his own followers (or otherwise tested in the real world) and found worthy, he's probably not someone to listen to automatically just because he associates himself with the teacher.

And, thanks for the thoughts on writing! That's hard to tell, especially when you're writing a lot and not frequently reviewing much... but one would hope that continually trying to improve in that regard does have an effect!

Chase

Dale's picture

Two things


Chase, have you ever read Dale Carnegie's other book "How to Stop Worrying and Start Living"? It is also very good.

Second, Christians need to seduce their wives (and keep seducing them, too.) The Married Man's Sex Life website often goes into this.

Chase Amante's picture

Re: Two things

Author

Dale-

I've not, but I've heard good things about it. I'll add it to my reading list. And a very good note on the necessity of always keeping a woman interested, no matter how long you've had her!

Chase

Juanito's picture

Great article!


This is truly a great article, and it really motivates me to want to read "How to Make Friends and Influence People." I've always been good at negotiating with people, but this article really has the information I need to excel in my negotiations.

Thanks, Chase! Your site is fantastic and has improved my life substantially.

Anonymous's picture

How to get invited?


what should i do in a situation where i'm not invited to an event or hangout? it might be unintentional but i don't want to invite myself.

also an even more advanced version: what do i do if one person doesn't like you and is either organizing the event and is trying to exclude you?

Chase Amante's picture

Re: How to get invited?

Author

Anon-

In my experience, the best thing to do is launch your own competing event and fill it with as many awesome people as you can. It's the inverse of "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em"; in this case, "If you can't join 'em, beat 'em."

Easy to do? Certainly not. Satisfying and educational when you pull it off? Incredibly.

You can also go the route of just building close alliances with so many of the other participants that the group leader is forced to invite you because everyone else there is constantly asking him, "Hey, how come Anon isn't here?" However, that's more of a crap shoot and leaves you less in control - so save that only for the things you don't care about as much. For the ones you care very much about, build your own alternative and make it good.

Chase

creek.steven's picture

how come everything is upside down in life?


In theory all the approaches to negotiations and all other life aspects look really easy but when you run into things in practice it's like oh oh I haven't thought about this one!

Chase what would be a good way of dealing with quilt? I have a complicated family life and I believe I've been the victim in my family and I'm still fighting with issues.
I was raised in a small town by traditional and rather conservative parents. I know they loved me and they wanted to give me everything but the problem was they were both emotionally unstable, especially the mother. She and my father never ever argued and it looked like everything was soooo perfect but it soooo wasn't.
There were days I'd come back from school and when she was not in a mood she used to pick on me. She told me I was stupid, I was untidy, I was a terrible mess etc.
She used to yell at me and pick on everything and when I asked her to give me specifics on what exactly she didn't like she never did but it infuriated her even more so it was always better just to shut up and be quiet as she could even come up to me and she started physical abusing when I was still a teenager.

My father has always been very passive, completely dependent on her in terms of running the house so even though he has always been a great, great man and did everything for me he never stopped her. He didn't have the nerve to ever stand up to her.

When I lived at home I never knew what I could expect, what mood she'd hit the day and at times I felt too paralysed to even leave my room.

They respected my younger brother more for him being smarter at school etc. She would also pick on him at times but never to such a degree like on me.

Now, I'm 32 and I haven't been living at home for a long time. A lot changed for better and I was always a welcomed guest. But all my family considers me a failure because I didn't marry. Last time I visited my family at Christmas and my parents reached the peak of their unfairness. They were both infuriated by my brother. They didn't tell him anything though because they respect him. He has a loving wife, a child they love (and they need to see regularly) and a good well-paid job. They were constatnly walking on eggshells around them. But when my bro with wife went for a walk my mother came up to me and started yelling at me. It really looked and felt like the old times, just yell at me to let off steam. She yelled at me for not having a family, being weird, criticized my hobbies, everything you could possibly think of.

I left. I'd read your articles about psychology. I'd spotted my mistakes. I'm a good person Chase, I didn't drink extensively, no smoking, no drugs. I don't deserve this treatment and I realized after reading your stuff that it's not me, it's how I let myself be treated all my life.

My mother hasn't spoken to me since then. My father called me and I told him how I won't let them treat me like that. But he didn't say anything to eat. He was surprised and said nothing. He called me before Easter to invite me for breakfast and I said I'd come and I didn't. I couldn't. I feel I've changed as a person, I started working on my fundamentals with girls and poeple at work and I couldn't go home to let my folks awake the old me.

I feel like they should apologize for behaving this way but I know they never will. For them everthing's perfect. I AM A FAILURE and she was a good mother to POINT IT OUT FOR ME. And now I'm so stupid that I can't even see it. My bro told me my father begrudges me for not coming over after "all the good things I received from them". My brother scolded me for that as if I was a little kid (he also feels superior to me and granted himself the right to first make laugh at me and then criticize me for not treating parents fair).

Chase I haven't done anything bad but I'm treated as if I'd spent many years in prison and can't normally spend time with my family on holidays. Now everything is turned upside down and I AM THE AWFUL PERSON who didn't come to visit a family. and my father is crying over it. But how could I sit down at the table prepared by my mother knowing that she didn't even invite me?

Everybody in my family turned their backs at me. I know I haven't done anything bad but I feel incredibly quilty. Why do I feel this way???

How to talk to them? They are creazy. My mother cleans the whole house 24/7 and I m sure it's a mental disorder. My dad keeps watching soapies... I think he's depressed. How to tell them they actually have a problem, not me.

I feel terribly sorry for them. I don't know how to solve this situation. I want to talk to them and have a good relations but if I come back there as if nothing happened I'll show them AGAIN that it's ok to treat me this way.

Why do they think that not having a family is such a big disaster that happened to me?

Do you think sometimes you just have to sit out the storm and show and prove people something? It's like with girls. CHase I have always made my intentions clear. I want to have a steady girlfriend, I want to be faithful. Then I discovered your site and I actually realized that you should NEVER tell people about your real intentions. And I see now how it works. I get better results when I don't say things. Why is life so upside down? I was not a boyfriend material when I said I want to be a boyfriend and showed all the good qualities. Why am I a better boyfriend materlial when I show I want only sex?
It really looks like you never tell people what you really want. If you want to have a girlfriend don't say you're looking for one! Show her you can take her for a dark ride god knows where and she'll all go crazy for you and tell you how she wants you in her life for good.
Why are poeple so messed up? I've always been a fan of opening my cards but I now I took on a different approach and realized that life is all about a game.

Thank you Chase!

Chase Amante's picture

Golden Child vs. Scapegoat

Author

Steven-

I'd suggest reading through this article:

Scapegoat or Golden Child: victims of narcissistic apartheid

Here's a quote:

In a narcissistic household, one (or more) members of the family are singled out to be the scapegoat, the one to whom the narcissists assigns blame for just about everything. I, for example, was told by my mother when I was 14 that everything that was wrong in her life was my fault—because I had been born! Taking responsibility for getting pregnant with me was not in the cards there—no, the fact of my existence was the reason her fine plans (fantasies) for her life had not panned out.

In these narcissistic household there in also at least one Golden Child, the child who can do no wrong, the child who is the spoiled darling of the narcissist. The Scapegoat may be even be held responsible for the behaviour of the Golden Child—when I was a kid, I got punished when my younger (but bigger) brother misbehaved because I was the oldest and it was therefore my job to make him do his chores and stay out of trouble. This was the case from as young as I can remember and the patent absurdity of making a scrawny 3 year old responsible for the actions of her sturdy, unsupervised toddler brother never seemed to dawn on my mother.

and this one:

Golden Child / Scapegoat

It's very common for Narcissistic Mothers to have a Golden Child / Scapegoat dynamic going on.

In short, one child in the family is the Golden Child, and one or more is the Scapegoat.

The Golden Child, as the name suggests, is the best and most wonderful - at least in the eyes of the Narcissistic Mother. It seems to be that the Narcissistic Mother picks the Golden Child to be an extension of herself, onto whom she projects all her own supposed wonderfulness.

The Golden Child can do no wrong. He or she gets given the best of everything - even apartments or houses bought for them. Their most minor achievements are celebrated and held up for admiration.

The Scapegoat on the other hand is, also as the name suggests, the person on whom all the ills of the family are projected. They can do no right. Their major achievements are dismissed. Any money spent on them is the bare minimum and is spent begrudgingly.

It sounds as though your mother is the classic narcissistic type, and your father functions as a codependent enabler (he's the traditional nice guy who wants everyone to get along, but he will submit himself to her whims to not piss her off and invoke her narcissistic wrath - they probably had it out before you were born and established the pecking order in that family before you ever came into the world, and he submitted).

I don't have much experience with the dynamic myself, except for some reading just out of curiosity, so for any "what to do" advice I'd recommend reading through these articles and possibly looking for support forums if you think this sounds like it fits your situation and seeing what other people have done and what's worked best.

As for why telling your intentions doesn't work... with women, it's typically because they want an experience that feels exciting, mysterious, and totally unpredictable. They would like to feel like it is that way for both parties, because they need that to relate to you. That's because people project their wants and feelings onto others, and women are in the passive / not-in-control position; finding out that you are in firm control, have clear objectives, and are following a step-by-step process to get them makes you immediately unrelatable to them. So, to keep the bond alive, you must feed back to them the feeling that you are like them and the two of you are the same, and you need to do this with everyone.

At it's core, the explanation is just that any two people interacting with each other *almost* never have exactly, perfectly, dead-even objectives with one another, and you don't show your full hand because you don't want to expose the differences between your intentions and another's intentions and let your differences become something that breaks you apart. This is true for things like business deals, etc. as well. BIG differences obviously you need to air out; if they're small ones and not key, often it's better just not to bring them up.

Chase

The M's picture

Quote


For anyone quickly reading Chase's reply: the thing about the mom at age 14 is a quote from the first article he linked, not about Chase's mom! I was confused for a bit. :)

Chase Amante's picture

Re: Quote

Author

Thanks M - something wrong with the post format there. All fixed now.

Chase

Anonymous's picture

Tips


Hey Chase, any quick tips on performing oral sex on girls and stimulating the clit specifically? I checked out the other articles but I couldn't get anything specific on the subject. Thanks!

Chase Amante's picture

Re: Tips

Author

Anon-

This is one that keeps popping up and it's probably a good one to get an article written up on - keep your eyes peeled and you'll see it later today.

Chase

J $'s picture

Shyness/Black


Hello Chase, I really want to start cold approaching, but im just so damn shy. And I make a lot of excuses for myself not to approach. Can you give me some tips and make an article on destroying your shyness? I'd appreciate it.

Chase, does this stuff work for black guys? Because the girls I always were around growing up were hoodrats and they like hood guys. They hate the polite type or educated type. Anyway, I ask is it for black guys because I've noticed that white people have it the easiest for this pua stuff. All I see is white puas and I hear most girls talking about how they want a white man. Black girls even say they're tired of black men and want a white man. Or on an online dating profile they will specifically say, "No black men". That's the only race they say, they don't say any other color but black.

I feel that everyone hates black as a whole, even black women themselves. I feel black guys hate themselves to a lesser extent than females do. But, it's like this a lot.

I tried running day game, but I felt like the girls were trying to not make eye contact and didn't want me to talk to them. I tried white girls. I read colts article and wanted to see how I'd do. So, I saw some white girls, they were alright and when I walked to them (we were heading into each other) I see them all of a sudden get on their phone and or walk faster. Im not starring, or even suggesting im going to approach. I just happen to be walking and they're walking to my direction. I feel they're scared of me and they don't want to be approached by a black guy. If they wanted to be approached they wouldn't be on their phone, texting or walking fast right? They won't even look in my direction.

1. How do I get these hoodrat girls while using the stuff on this site?

2. Was I right on my assumption on how girls go on their phone and text just to not want talk to you and make you avoid approaching?

3. Should I even approach them and what do I say when a girl is texting or talking on the phone?

4. How can I make white girls or any other girls that I pass on the street stop being scared or turned off by me?

Thank you Chase

Chase Amante's picture

Re: Shyness/Black

Author

J$-

I have noted down in our article queue for an article on shyness already (though I'm probably not the best one to write it), but I'll add another note next to it.

On being black - sure, I know plenty of black guys who are quite adept at picking up girls in streets, bars, nightclubs, etc. Usually especially non-black girls - I'm sure they can pick up black girls too, but most of the cities I've lived in we tend not to run into black girls quite as often (or maybe we just frequent different parts of town).

In fact, one of our writers here is a black guy, and he had an article on picking up white girls right here: "How Black Guys Can Have Sex with White Girls."

Some girls will stick their noses abruptly into their phones to try and dissuade you from approaching, yes. If you get eye contact followed by a rapid switch into staring at the phone, that's usually a loud and clear "don't talk to me" sign (I get that sometimes as a white guy too... it's color blind; just if she doesn't like your looks or something else about you triggers that reaction in her, you'll get it).

If she's texting or talking on the phone, you can try approaching, but you'll generally have a pretty low opening rate unless you come in very strong and she really likes your look. Otherwise, better just to hold on until she's laid off the texting / hopped off the phone. If you must approach, go direct and open with a strong, sincere compliment, because anything else is feels incongruent as a reason for interrupting someone's phone call or text. Just don't take it too hard if you get rejected - you need to be firing on all cylinders or really just be exactly her "type" (or one of her types) to pull this off and have it go well usually.

Chase

Troy's picture

Black Girls


Chase -

I've been looking right around the site for an article on "light skinned men getting dark girls" and how to game them e.t.c.

I have found myself a lot lately to find a really deep love and passion for black girls. I didn't always feel this way, especially when i was a lot younger. In fact, about 3 years ago when i started watching porn at age 15 i mostly watched porn with white girls until eventually i started out of curiosity watching ebony porn. I know you said that porn is bad but maybe if it wasn't for porn then i would not find myself opened up to a many different women because before that i only liked white girls. Now i love all women every color. porn also helped me to appreciate asian and blonde girls that i once hated, but even still my passion most of all is for black women (a brown cock in a dark girl's pussy). Porn has had a few negatives on my life ( i was not addicted, just watched it when i was bored Every now and again) and i'm now giving up the porn. in fact porn has become a boring media to watch that i feel asleep during the video . Most of my early success with girls has all been with black girls. As for my complexion, i am brown/light skinned but still far enough away from white.

I'm not from the america, i'm from the Caribbean ( now that's something else you learned about me...)

I recall in a few articles you talk about visiting the Caribbean. which country's have you been to in the Caribbean?

How do you game Caribbean girls? why is it that black girls are so warm compared to other girls?

I realize that the main reason why you don't yet have an article on getting black girls is because of the whole touchiness of the topic and that possibly lead to internet junkies just looking to find something to attack and say is wrong.... but chase i would say just ignore them ( but maybe choose your words and pictures more carefully for this one.

What is your experience like with black girls?

How do we get black girls (game them)?

Even though i got most of my preselection and girlfriends from black girls, i still find them hard to get. What are the different things a man needs to get dark girls compared to others ( and in relation to this article on social circle)?

What do you have up your sleeve on the topic of gaming black girls as a light-skinned guy?

Id love to hear your perspective on this topic and maybe if it interests you that you cook up an article on this one!

Cheers

Troy

Troy's picture

A part of my comment seems to


A part of my comment seems to be missing Chase, and i was wonderind if you could join the rest of the comment to the one above. something seems to have went wrong after the link was made. I need to do some vmore reading up on making links, i guess. If you cant find the original comment then use this one please and thanks in addition to the one above. here it is below!

Most of my early success with girls has all been with black girls. As for my complexion, i am brown/light skinned but still far enough away from white.

Im not from the america, im from the caribbean ( now thats something else you learned about me...)

I recall in a few articles you talk about visiting the caribbean. which country's have you been to in the caribbean?

How do you game caribbean girls? why is it that black girls are so warm compared to other girls?

I realize that the main reason why you dont yet have an article on getting black girls is because of the whole touchiness of the topic and that possibly lead to internet junkies just looking to find something to attack and say is wrong.... but chase i would say just ignore them ( but maybe choose your words and pictures more carefully for this one.

What is your experience like with black girls?

How do we game black girls as a light skinned/white guy?

Even with my experience with black girls they still are a struggle to get. Could you shed some light on this topic about gaming black girls, if that interests you?

Thanks

Troy

Chase Amante's picture

Re: Black Girls

Author

Troy-

I fixed the comment for you here - you were missing the closing bracket on the end of your "" tag.

Black girls (in general) are different from white girls, at least in the States, in that American black girls require a lot more ball-busting than white girls do, and tolerate/enjoy a far higher level of outright sexual humor - some black girls you may pick up spending almost half your time just straight chase framing them, with only dashes of connection-focused conversation tossed in here and there.

I only have a bit of experience with Caribbean women, but I find this to be even more true for them - just go hard on the sexual humor and innuendo, and they eat it up and get turned on and play the sexual banter right back with you. They do not seem to respect men who cannot do this and/or who dance around sexual issues. Those men are nice, but not sexual options. Whereas if you go as hard with a white girl or an Asian girl as you do with a black girl, you will tend to blow yourself out... more subtlety is usually called for.

As far as my experience goes, I've visited the Bahamas and the Dominican Republic, though I didn't run game at either. The only Caribbean girls I've picked up in the States that I recall have been from Trinidad and Tobago, and from Puerto Rico. The Trinidad and Tobago girls were either black or Indian (from India) descent (apparently a lot of Indians moved to Trinidad; never thought I'd meet a Caribbean girl with the middle name "Lakshmi"), and both types responded very well to loads of physical dominance and strong sexual humor; Puerto Ricans for me have all been Hispanic, or Hispanic mixed (maybe with a dash of black in them), and required a more subdued approach.

So, I'd say: as a light-skinned guy, your biggest issue with dark-skinned women is being perceived as "weak" or a "pushover." For that reason, you can essentially be as aggressive with physicality and sexuality as you want (while still remaining as smooth and effortless as possible) and not worry about coming across as over-the-top most of the time. This makes them pretty fun to pick up and a nice change of pace from the balancing act you have to put on with lighter skinned women (because let's be honest, it's just FUN being über dominant and sexual!).

Chase

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