GIRLS CHASE MONTHLY SUBSCRIPTION
• Unlimited access to GirlsChase.com
Sales has a lot in common with dating. If you know one field, it helps you do well in the other. Where do the two fields overlap the most? 16 key places.
In my article “The Beginning is the Hardest Part”, commenter Carver Montana requests an article on where sales and seduction overlap:
“Hey Chase,
Thanks for another great article!
As I was reading the start of it, I got to thinking... I’ve seen you mention your experience in sales a number of times throughout your articles. From what I can gather, it was one of the things that helped you in various ways to ultimately become better with women.
Now, normally when you write about your sales experience, you seem to relate it pick up more or less indirectly. For example, you tell a story about how you went from being looked down upon by your co-workers to eventually gaining their respect, and then you relate that to an article about rising through the social ranks and so on. But I am curious as to why I’ve never seen you write about how sales pertain more directly to pick up.
I know a bit about sales myself (I’m an online marketer) and I know that there is a lot of overlap between the psychology of sales and that of pick up. No doubt you’re keenly aware of this. Hell, I even see you using common sales terminology, such as “closing” and “buying temperature.”
I feel like an article on the similarities between sales and pick up could be a good read. It would be nice to see on the site, if you think it would be appropriate ;)”
Carver is right – I’ve referenced sales repeatedly throughout my writing. Some articles on here directly pull from my sales experience. Much of the terminology in the pickup / seduction world comes from sales terminology as well (though I should that terminology was already in place when I discovered pickup). And I do toss in sales anecdotes and sales analogies pretty often.
So, what exactly is the overlap between seduction and sales? Is there a perfect analogy between the two, or are there places the two don’t connect as well?
Let’s give you some tools to better compare the two. Along the way, if you’re familiar with sales you might find a few extra tools you can apply in your courtships that perhaps you haven’t applied already. And if you’re not familiar with sales, but you are familiar with seduction, you may just find sales less alien territory for you than you might think.
Comments
Very interesting article
Very interesting article Chase.
After working telesales in an office for many years, I've recently started a career in face-to-face sales and opening up prospects - more or less any suitable store I can find or is on my route to another call etc.
It certainly makes you more consciously aware of the importance of having a kept appearance, open body language, friendly gestures and all the rest that goes with it, especially when you get the nerves and have to go in cold to a store, introduce yourself to a number of people - or just one, with others watching and listening, and it feels like you are pretty much on show, but once they see that you can hold it down and maintain a presence and give them what they want etc, it's very rewarding.
Almost anything we do in life is sales, or has aspects of it one way or another, and I always find it amusing when people say 'oh you're a salesman...'
So now, I just say I work in marketing and business development, which is partially true I guess.
Anyway...to the point of my comment...
Any chance we could get an article on how to end a relationship/breakup etc? I know there's one on here already but realised it's awhile out of date, and you're thought process now may be a little different, and have a different outlook on how we should pump the brakes on a relationship, especially if we have a long term goal for it, and then have a change of heart and want to call it quits before we're in too deep.
If not that, a recommended reading volume 2 article would be nice, or one on how to control movement speed (sometimes I'm slow, but othertimes I get caught off guard and go fast, or I get fidgety if I don't move around enough), or last but not least an article on humour - what kind of jokes make a girl wetter, or think of you a more of a sexual beast?
Ryan
Breaking Up, Fidgety, Humor
Ryan-
Yes, "Oh, you're a salesman." Roughly translates as, "I guess I'd better take anything you say with a grain of salt," right? :) I used to get that one sometimes, though I haven't described myself as a salesman in a long time.
You mean "How to Break Up", correct (and not "Letting a Girl Down")? Assuming the former, nope, that's how I handle it! Sounds like you're coming up on the exit but having qualms about taking the off-ramp. Nope, no other tips I can give other than you've just got to make it happen. I know it's tough if she's not giving you a reason (e.g., not picking fights with you or doing anything terrible). Sometimes I wonder how many marriages have come about because one partner or the other was just too nice to break it off. I'll bet a bunch have...
Noted on the article ideas. One book I'm reading right now is Jonathan Haidt's The Righteous Mind. Keep meaning to write some articles on bits I've highlighted from it. Great way of blowing up mental models.
Fidgety, best thing I've found is just be more aware of it and catch yourself and slow down and be more deliberate even when surprised. Over time you condition yourself to respond slower most of the time. Although do realize there's a certain degree of automatic threat response going on - to get something closer to full control, the only thing you can really do is work on the underlying fears that cause the response. e.g., put yourself in more dangerous situations and learn how to handle yourself in them, take combat training, etc., so bumps in the night don't startle as much.
As for humor, it very much depends on the girl - some girls like sexy humor, some girls like goofy humor, some girls like self-deprecation, etc. Best thing to do is calibrate to the girl by test driving different humor types around her and seeing how she responds to them.
Anyway, I have these jotted down in the topic ideas list now too.
Chase
Thank you Chase
I wanted to personally say thanks you! I turned from an awkward, insecure, awkward nerdy dude who's been with less than 5-6 women when I moved to Hawaii ~5 years ago, to a confident, ambitious, and successful man. Your content is what got me stated on a new life and way of thinking. This is only just the beginning, but the new women I regularly meet have changed my life, and this goes far beyond just my romantic life. Genuine thanks :)
Quick topic/article request for you. How does being in touch with your feminine side/metrosexual/etc. affect seduction? In my experience, it does quite a bit. Of note, I have not cried in about 18 years. So, I purposely get myself into a sensitive, 'fruity' vibe and what this does is, my physical escalation skyrockets and women are very receptive to this in a positive way. I have taken many women to bed on the first meet/first date this way. Its not that I "fake" anything, because I want to touch these women and talk about more "feminine" things like feelings etc., but I am not naturally in the mindset, the majority of the time.
Rock on!
-Andrey
You may have covered this in a previous post, in one context or other.
Feminine Side
Pleased to hear it, Andrey! You're in Honolulu / Waikiki, I reckon? It's a fun town.
Using your feminine or metrosexual side - yeah, that's a great idea. I have it on the topics queue now. We've dipped into it here and there but no dedicated articles on it. I will see what I can do...
Chase
Asking permission / Pacifying / Look and Touching her
Hey Chase,
This article really relates to me now ever since my new job.
Thanks for these articles, and your comments.
They're like a light guiding me down the same road, thank you.
Re: Asking permission
I've had people contact me to hang out (after I called them), and I notice a couple things but let's skip that before I write essays again.
Throughout my calling, I have some people not picking up and would text me in reply (including women).
Not sure what this means, however I feel tempted to ask them when would be a good time to call them.
It feels off though, law of least effort?
I just call them again after a few days (no call and text since my sales mentor restricts texting)
Anyway, I also had some people ask me "Can I call you at this time?" before calling me.
It feels weird to me as the receipient as well.
"Asking permission to talk" is what I call it.
Your thoughts with women or friends in general?
Re: Pacifying
Watched some movies lately, and I noticed how the guys in movie would act like a clown (not exactly, but they do something to make the girl laugh) when the girl is sulking and ignoring them (was warm before - auto rejection).
Is this a good way to bring girls from cold to warm again?
The girl would proceed to giggle and the guy would say, "There, you laughed... now tell me, what's wrong?" or they would keep playful tune and start escalating (hilarious movie btw).
Re: Don't look at your hands!
I want to clarify, do you mean not to look at her hands or ours when we grab her hands or after contact is made?
I tried pre-opening with hand touch on lower arm or elbow, but without looking!
I would miss and accidentally touch her side (thank God not her chest!)
My terrible peripheral :(
Lastly, great upgrade with the site!
It looks great!
However, do you think it's possible to add a "old theme" option?
I'm more of a classical person, and I really loved the old theme sort of the same with the forums too.
If you can do the same for the site, that'll be perfect!
Best,
Lawliet
Calling / Texting Rules, Bringing Her Out of a Sour Mood
Lawliet-
Texting in response to a phone call is often a deescalation.
However, not always. Some girls can be shy and maybe aren't used to hopping on the phone. Usually you want to text them back once after they've texted you before you call again. They're reaching out to you and establishing a line of communication; you cement it in the lower context medium (text), and then take another stab at moving it higher context (phone).
I would not ask permission to call someone, no. If you must do it, just make it super casual, like, "Hey, on the run right now, but cool if I give you a ring tonight?" I wouldn't make it any more formal or specific than that.
The 'act like a clown' thing sounds silly, but it works if you're doing it from a position of strength. Do something silly --> she snaps out of it and laughs --> then you tell her to tell you what's wrong. Yep, that's the process. What you're actually doing is pulling her out of a negative state - where she doesn't want to talk to you - and putting her into a positive one, where she'll tend to be more open. And because you change moods immediately after and she sees you were doing it as a conscious tool to alter her emotions, it doesn't look needy or weak.
Use your peripheral vision to look at where to put your hands. Don't stare at your hands directly.
If the old theme worked, we could enable it. However, we changed a lot of stuff on the backend that no longer works with the old theme anymore. Most of the site looks broken under the old theme at this point... Hopefully you'll be able to adapt to the new one ;)
Chase
Well Done Chase!
Honestly, this article it was even better than I would have expected. In large part, it's because of the 11 points where the 2 skills don't perfectly match up. It's probably important so that people don't finish the article thinking that they can just go get some sales training and suddenly they'll be top-level seducers, lol.
One commonality that I could add onto the list: Fundamentals. In sales, just like seduction, it can only help to be an overall attractive person who presents themselves well. Of course it doesn't translate perfectly either, especially in terms of fashion. With in-person sales, having a bad boy look will help if you're selling tattoos or guitars, but an appliance salesman obviously would need to need to look professional. But in any situation, a badly dressed dude who slouches and avoids eye contact will likely have a hard time making sales.
There is one thing I'm curious about... Was working in sales what first lead you to focus on moving fast with women?
Thanks for the great article Chase!
Moving Faster
Carver-
Great addition on fundamentals, for sure. All the great salesmen I've known have had great posture, easy laughs/smiles, good strong masculine presences, warm personas, etc. Hard to really excel in sales without 'em.
Sales did not get me moving faster, no. I realized girls won't wait around for you after I lost a number of them by moving too slow (attraction expires). And I realized the harm of missing escalation windows after I'd seen girls who'd been giving me lots of signals suddenly go cold and start hitting on other guys and ignoring me. So I decided I couldn't just sit around and gradually shepherd seductions toward sex.
I also had a mentor who moved really fast, and spending time around him made me realize I was wasting too much time doing stuff that really didn't help me much with girls. I had some big speed gains after spending time with him picking up girls in various cities. Just one of those things that shatters how you previously thought things were supposed to work, so you drop a lot of the old stuff you used to do that took up time but didn't do much, and switch to more efficient processes.
Chase
Achieving Mindfulness
Chase,
Could you give me some quick tips and maybe make an article on achieving mindfulness?
I always have thoughts going off in my head 24/7. It's annoying, I think about negative stuff, people in my past, people in general, i just want an open mind, I really want to get rid of thoughts, but they just keep popping up in my head, especially when I'm asleep.
It's gotten so bad that I have to do a ritual to get rid of my bad thoughts that come in my mind 24/7.
I want to stop that.
I want to achieve mindfulness.
Thanks
Mindfulness
SZ-
First 10 minutes of the day, immediately after you wake up.
Sit in a lotus position, close your eyes, and focus on your breathing.
Breathe slow. As you inhale, notice a thought. As you exhale, let that thought go.
Inhale, notice a thought. Exhale, let that thought go.
Do that for 10 minutes, and your mind will be blank at the end of it. You should have a solid 20 to 30 minutes of feeling great, stress-free, and super mindful.
The more important thing this exercise teaches you though is thought control. You become much more conscious of what's going through your head, and how these thoughts drive your emotions.
And once you know what's rattling around up there, you can start taking steps to channel the direction you want it going in.
Chase
What you think...
Hey Chase! I was wondering since your into business what do you think about MLM business models?
Sales blog or book
Hi Chase,
First of all, thank you very much for your blog.
Over the last year, it has helped me so much. I have been around learning about seduction for several years but it wasn't until I found Girlschase that everything started to make sense as a whole instead of many isolated techniques.
Your articles are very comprehensive and help me get the bigger more complete view old many complex issues.
So, basically I am currently working on sales, on those big B2B contracts you speak about and I am getting a little discouraged because it is not going very well.
I have been chasing some opportunities for almost two years with no near close and extremely long wait times. The people in my office tell me it is common in this line of business but I feel there is much that could be done.
I was wondering if you could recommend another blog or book on sales that is similar in style to GirlsChase.
I resonate very well with its style and I know that if I could find something similar for B2B sales, then I would be able to reach the next level.
Thanks in advance!!!
Keeping your pipeline full
Hi Chase,
I was reading a sales book not long ago where the main message was to keep finding new clients all the time, and to fill up a pipeline of several weeks with meetings and sales pitches, so that you have momentum and appear to be a man of high value to clients. I liked the idea, but as I don't work in sales, I could only apply it to some aspects of my social life, like dating and organizing programs with friends, and I think it is a good approach. I'm a regular reader here, and when I opened this article, I thought I will come across this idea of 'keeping a full pipeline' as a similarity. I'm not there to bug you, I'm just curious.
Is there a reason it's left out? What do you think about this?
Keep up the good work,
Lazlo
Leave a Comment