The Wrapping and the Present


wrapping vs. presentsOver the past month, 340Breeze, one of our members and commenters here, has made a couple of insightful comments and asked a few thoughtful questions about a subject that can be fairly boiled down to "the wrapping and the present".

His first comment was in the article on specialness (comment here).

And his second was in the piece on reversing poor precedent (comment here).

The first comment discussed his experiences meeting women who seemed outwardly impressive at first, but lacking in substance after he got to know them; in the second comment, he asked whether it was better for a woman interested in capturing a good man to focus more on playing coy and drawing things out with men (what I'd term "game" and "fundamentals", or style), or on becoming such all-around awesome people that they were simply naturally already in very high demand (who you really are as a person, friend, and mate - your substance).

In fact, this dichotomy - of fundamentals and game vs. who you are, style vs. substance, or the wrapping vs. the present - is one that underlies all of social dynamics, whether mating and dating, or choosing whom you want to be friends with, or hiring employees, bringing on consultants, or selecting the company you want to go work for.

The key here, and what everyone's trying to do, is to avoid being suckered by nice wrapping that isn't backed up by an equally impressive present underneath... but also not miss the great presents hiding under crummy wrapping paper.

Yet, that isn't so easy to do.


wrapping vs. presents

Men and women share similar annoyances with their love lives when you look at things in the terms of the wrapping and the present.

Women get frustrated because the assholes and bad boys they go for - who are oh so sexy and charismatic - just turn out to be not very good guys, leave them high and dry, and don't come close to matching the high expectations they had for them early on, based on their extravagant wrapping.

And men? Well, right around the same point in their lives that women start realizing that those flashy, sexy bad boys are no good for relationships, men start realizing that those dolled up hot girls with perfect hair, nails, and make up, and all those flashy, sexy party girls they spent so much time and money chasing after as the brass ring of dating life, really aren't the kind of girls you want to take home to mama... and for all their beautiful wrapping, the present you get underneath is not nearly up to par.

With time and experience, most men and women alike come to realize that those who focus most on their wrapping often focus least on the present beneath, and those who focus most on the present frequently forget about their wrapping altogether.

But, not always.

And, before we write off those with flashy wrappers completely, let's take a more nuanced view of the long-game, and how everything plays out both rationally... and emotionally.


The Long-Game: Focus on the Present?

Your first instinct might be to say that the wrapping is the "short-game", and the present the "long-game."

Your style is only good for getting you in the door of that exclusive party; it's your substance that keeps you there.

However... you wouldn't be entirely correct.

That's because, you see, a mental model that says "The wrapping is the short-game, and has no impact on the long-term, and the present is the long-game, and the only thing that matters later on down the road" is a flawed mental model; it fails to take into account that one thing we know is so very important to all relationships: precedent.

And the most important precedent you set is the precedent you set early on, when the wrapper is still on and the present has yet to be fully revealed (or, unwrapped).

I'll give you an anecdotal example: following a big breakup from the longest and most serious relationship of my life, I found myself casting about, emotionally needy for the first time in almost forever. I slept with a string of new girls, but it didn't help; I needed a rebound relationship. I lacked absolute abundance and wasn't confident I could find another replacement girlfriend as great as that one I'd parted with.

So, I broke form, and started chasing a girl.

This girl was a classic hot girl cocktease: she made herself up to look way more sexy and appealing than she really was (without makeup / clothes / nice hair); her personality was the kind that men just find addictive; and she constantly harped the damsel in distress role that made you just want to scoop her up and tell her she was all safe now - you'd protect her, my fair lady.

And whatever base you'd call getting her shirt off and sucking on her breasts - second base, third base - whatever base that was, I just could not get past it. She wouldn't let me. She'd shut me down like nobody's business.

I ended up spending around two months chasing this girl - interspersing it with other women I was actually taking as lovers (fortunately; or I'd have gone completely insane) - before I regained control of myself, cut it out, and cut contact with her and gave her the boot from my life.

After her, I dated a number of women who were ALL of the below:

  • Smarter than her
  • Better educated than her
  • Less needy / dependent / depressive than her
  • More beautiful in the face than her
  • In possession of better bodies with thinner waists and larger breasts / buttocks
  • More personable, sociable, and charismatic than her
  • Less self-conscious than her
  • Lower in partner counts and previous relationships than her
  • Yet, also more sexually comfortable than her, and more comfortable with men

... and even still, I could still feel emotions rattling around for her in my skull that none of these subsequent girlfriends managed to generate. Emotions of scarcity, desire, and need.

Not based on anything remotely rational. Totally emotional.

The girl in question ended up pursuing me hard for sex and a relationship after I parted ways with the first girlfriend I had after cutting contact with her; despite my emotional cravings/yearnings, I turned her down, because I knew she didn't come close to stacking up with the kinds of girls I landed as girlfriends quality-wise, and the emotions she'd put in me for her meant there was some risk she'd be able to rope me into a bad decision relationship... it just wasn't worth it to me.

But it was very curious to me: here was an across-the-board lower caliber girl in every way than my previous and subsequent girlfriends, yet I felt more for her because I'd spent so much more time chasing after her and investing emotionally in her before ever getting sex.

Conversely, the actual girlfriends I took I generally slept with within two weeks of first meeting them - and often within a day or two. And all were girls I spent little time on before intimacy, and forbade myself from thinking about or getting worked up about emotionally prior to sex (so as not to get feelings prematurely that would affect our chances of actually really getting together in the first place).

And this isn't just me. I've noted it in guy after guy after guy - just scan through the comments section of "Can't Stop Thinking About Her? Here's Why You Need to Meet More Girls" and look at how many men (and even some women) there are confessing out-of-control emotions for people they haven't even slept with yet.

For all they know, these hotly desired prospective partners may be 95% wrapping and 5% present, and even if they got them, all they'd find on the inside was a sooty lump of coal.

But I bet you a hundred bucks that'd be the most beloved lump of coal they would ever blacken their hands with... and even years later, those feelings would not have completely worn off.

That's because of the phenomenon of precedent; and that's because the emotions we tie to something early on into knowing it are the emotions that we associate with it for the rest of our lives, no matter how much things change.


Emotions are Dumb

In some ways, emotions are incredibly powerful allies:

  • They alert us to danger we didn't even realize was there

  • They prevent us from sinking time into most obvious lost causes

  • They can inspire us to go above and beyond our normal capacity when needed

  • They steer us to opportunities with excitement, and away from useless repetition with boredom

... nevertheless, they can also be incredibly blockheaded.

wrapping vs. presentsOne of the biggest ways they can be this way is by forming set emotional opinions about people and things based on early impressions that turn out to be taken from the wrapping, rather than the present underneath that wrapping.

I used to be a big fan of the mid-1980s television show Pee-wee's Playhouse when I was a kid. Pee-wee Herman was hilarious, and the show was great (fun fact: Laurence Fishburne - Morpheus from The Matrix and the dad from Boyz in the Hood - played Cowboy Curtis in the show). Then it went off the air when Pee-wee got caught masturbating in an adult movie theater.

He later tried to make a comeback, but again, another ball dropped; this time, he got raided by police, who discovered a cornucopia of homosexual and borderline kiddie porn material in his house; he argued it was art, and a dealer who sold it to him claimed he was a pure collector, straight up, and bought in such bulk there was no way to know what he was getting, but nevertheless, that's a pretty sticky thing to get found with having in your possession.

Yet, my emotional impression of Pee-wee is still that he's a swell, family-friendly, and wholesome guy - and based on the number of Twitter followers he has, I'd suspect I'm in the majority, not the minority.

If the first thing I heard about Pee-wee was that he'd been masturbating in a movie theater and they found a bunch of pictures of naked boys in his house, and then I saw Pee-wee's House after, I guarantee you I would've been creeped out the entire time I watched the show, imagining it as his ploy to play the pied piper to little children.

But because I saw the show first, and heard the news after, I still see him as a wholesome guy who's great for the whole family. And that's how impressions work. You can wear away at them with bad subsequent precedent... but they are more or less set once you've formed 'em.

So... while you may WANT to say "the wrapping doesn't matter" and "it's all just for show" and "real beauty is what's on the inside"... the truth is not so simple.

Because as important as the present is (and there's no denying it's a huge part of the long-term stability and success of any sort of relationship), the wrapping has effects that continue to dazzle, long after it's been torn off and cast to the side.


wrapping vs. presents

After the incident with that girl I chased - and I've never been the kind of guy who ends up in the friend zone, not even when I was hopeless with women - I realized I needed to make a permanent change in how I interacted with women:

I needed to minimize all chances of being dazzled by the wrapping, and get to the present as quickly as possible.

I did this several ways:

  1. I forced myself to be even stricter about not thinking about / imagining / fantasizing about girl's I'd met whom I hadn't slept with yet. I even forbade myself from talking about them with friends - doing as much would make me want to highlight the girl's attractive qualities to the friend (which would mean I was thinking about them and emoting over them), and might make him act excited or otherwise get me to think about her more and put more pressure on myself to get her and begin investing increasingly more in her emotionally

  2. I restricted the amount of time I allowed myself to pursue a girl down to a several-week window if using date compression, and, most of the time, primarily just to a single date to make everything happen, unless there were some kind of unique, extenuating circumstances (e.g., a girl misunderstood directions to where I told her to go, went to the wrong place, then got upset/panicky, and I ended up going to meet her, messing up logistics for the date - flexibility's really the only option here if you're being even halfway reasonable)

  3. I made cutting contact with women it didn't work out with in the allotted time period final, rather than the previous, "Well, maybe I'll check in with her in a couple of months and see if her desire to meet up / do something has changed," stance it used to be (in my experience, these women invariably shift you into a boyfriend prospect role, unless you're leaving town or they are - you had your shot with them earlier, didn't take it, but you stuck around, so you must be a good provider... that's too much work trying to pursue for a girl it didn't work out the first time with, if you ask me - if there was a spark, there'd have been a spark)

I've also extended a similar process to other things in life (new friends; business ventures; etc.), with only slightly modified rules; but for the sake of simplicity, we'll stick to talking about women and dating here.

You might think of going for a roll in the hay with a girl as taking the wrapping off (in more ways than one).

It is, after all, sort of difficult to keep up appearances when you've seen her appearance without all the trappings of what she puts on to impress in polite society. And while it is possible to play games in the relationship, at least early on, good sex and good relationship management skills tend to get people to knock this off and get sincere pretty quickly.

Thus, for our purposes, a convenient shorthand for "getting to the present" with women you're interested in is "getting to sex" - and the more you can do this without getting emotionally invested in the wrapping, the better off you are.

Of course, especially when you're just starting out, that can be easier said than done.


Why Would You Want to Ignore the Wrapping?

The biggest reason I can think of for wanting to ignore the wrapping and forego emotionally investing in it is because it will soon be gone.

Assuming, that is, you ever unwrap the present.

If you see a gift box sitting there waiting for you, with the most beautiful wrapping paper and the most ornate bow sitting atop it, and you stare at it and imagine what must be inside and lust over how bad you want to tear all that wrapping off and get to the interior, what are the chances that what's inside measures up to or exceeds those expectations you're building?

Further, once the wrapping paper is off and discarded into the corner, you're still going to have that memory of it in your head - with some mix of disappointment that what you've got now isn't as exciting as that anticipation you once felt for it, and some fear of not giving this present up, because who knows if you'll ever receive another one you feel so strongly about again. And besides, with all the investment you put into it before you even opened it, you really value this present - even if it turns out it isn't all that useful or high quality of a present after all. But you can't help it - emotionally, you just don't want to give it up and go get something better. It's too hard.

Letting your emotions be determined by the wrapping sets you up for both disappointment in what you actually get, and improper valuation of what you actually get later on down the line.

It fools you into pursuing relationships that are all wrong for you.

I spoke with a friend about this just a few days ago. He was telling me about how he met his wife - at the time, he'd been sleeping with a handful of different women, and chasing after some women he was really excited about. When he met the woman who's now his wife, they quickly hooked up, and he felt little emotion toward her. Then, when he tried to see her again later, she announced that she'd gotten a boyfriend in the interim; he was a little surprised, but was fine to keep chasing those other girls. When he met up with her again 6 months later and she was single once more, they slept together again, and ended up moving in and getting married, and now are expecting their first child.

My friend reported that now that he's spent some time with her, he's amazed by how well his wife and he get along together - they have very compatible views, interests, and the like. And he's also amazed by how badly he wanted those other girls - girls who, he now realizes, were very poor matches for him.

So why did he want those other women so desperately - women who weren't right for him at all? The reason, of course, was the wrapping - unlike his wife, they drew things out with him, played games, acted coy and aloof, and made his heart beat and pang and lust for them.

His mind smiles at the union with his wife. But had his heart won out, it'd have placed him with women he'd have a far more strained, unpleasant, mismatched relationship with - albeit, one that would have had hanging over it always the memory of a lusty seduction and emotion-drenched courtship.

Thus, why you ignore the wrapping: you ignore the wrapping to bypass the fool's gold of presentation designed to play to your emotions by those who know what they're doing - and who know which buttons to push.


What Should You Focus Your OWN Efforts Upon?

Attractiveness or person?

Style or substance?

Wrapping or present?

It's an ever-timely question: do you focus on developing your appearance, or on what lies beneath it and what backs it up?

I noted in response to one of Breeze's two comments that each of us only has so much time in his life, and we can only focus so much of our energies into one area or another - rarely if ever will you find an individual who has the grandest wrapping covering up the most magnificent gift. A truly grand wrapping often belies a modest (or worse) gift, while the most magnificent gifts very often boast unimpressive wrappings.

However, if you want my opinion, it's vitally important that you focus on both areas of yourself, though not perhaps in completely equal amounts. My suggestion would be about 60% present, and 40% wrapping.

In the area of seduction and getting girls, the present would be things like:

... and things that have to do with being mentally strong and personally attractive, even while not in "gaming mode" or out being social; while the wrapping would include such things as:

... and things of that nature - things that deal with process; things that you do to achieve specific results, rather than things that you are or ways you behave simply because those are the things you are and behave like.

This ties back to the "under promise, over deliver" mantra I evangelize - you want to position yourself such that when people get to your real value (the present), they're amazed and blown away - they didn't even suspect it was going to be this awesome.

Yet... you must also have such great wrapping that people are lining up to get access to what you've got - you want women ready to hop on you the moment you walk into the bar, in other words.

To do this, of course, you need great wrapping, and an even better present underneath that great wrapping. That's where a strong focus on personal improvement comes in.

The good news is, when you're doing a roughly 60/40 split between focusing on present and focusing on wrapping, you get a nice little synergistic loop going on that benefits both - because you know that people will be consistently impressed when they get to the real meat of what you've got to offer (the "present"), you're going to feel even more confident putting out an impressive lure in the first place (the "wrapping").

And, as you get more and more invitations, opportunities, and successes from all the hands you get working to tear off that sparkly wrapping you've dressed yourself up in, you're able to rack up experiences and make your substance-side of things (the "present") all the better.

wrapping vs. presents

You forego these synergistic gains by focusing too much on just one aspect of things - focus mostly on the wrapping, and you'll get so much disappointment by the time people reach the present that they mostly just leave, which leaves you clueless as to how to keep them around, and usually only inspires you to work even harder on the wrapping to attract even more attention to replace those individuals you keep losing.

Conversely, focus mostly on the gift, and you get few opportunities to show what you've got... because no one feels much of a burning compulsion to look inside that beat up old cardboard box in the far corner of the room.

For the greatest gains in both departments, you must work on wrapping and present.


Don't Hate the Wrapping

... I know it's easy to do. You see it all over the Internet:

Women are so vain and shallow.

Men are such shallow assholes.

But the wrapping is important. It's how we reel others in - it's our magnet, our gravity well, our tractor beam. You might have tons of great substance, and girls who know you from social circle might pick up on your good traits if they're around you enough even without good presentation, but you still won't be triggering that raw, primal excitement in them that well-pressed style does.

What people get miffed about is either ending up with others whom they then realize had a lot less to offer than they initially expected, based on shiny wrapping paper... or they're miffed about not ending up with others whom they wanted to end up with (because they looked so shiny), but weren't attractive enough themselves, wrapping-wise, to draw in those others.

Thus, the need for training yourself to ignore the wrapping and form zero expectations around it... while simultaneously cultivating your own wrapping (and continuing to build your present up even more underneath).

The combination of impressive wrapping (and present) of your own with the ability to see but not be taken in by the dazzling wrapping of others puts you in great position to screen for those others who have not only great wrapping, but great presents underneath that wrapping too, and to draw in those others with an enticing lure - because you yourself seem to, and in fact do, have great things on offer, too.

Chase Amante

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Comments

Anonymous's picture

Allocation of time


This is the article you need to reference when people ask you why anyone should cultivate themselves to improve their ability to interact with and ultimately develop relationships with women, and people in general. Everyday I see myself going back and forth on whether or not I should cultivate "game" to be happy. Of course we would need to define the parameters for a happiness equation, but generally I think most people want great relationships with great men and women. When you ask someone who lies too much in one extreme, you end up with an unbalanced result. For example, an overconfident person might say he doesn't need game or self cultivation to be happy because girls SHOULD come to him regardless of his "wrapping". A paranoid person might go to the extreme that everyone should be trying to model themselves after Chase and be exactly like him or else they will lead a fruitless life. I've felt both extremes in totality. The real answer lies not in some philosophical perspective of what should I do, but what will actually yield good results. There are enough women in this world that with a little bit of wrapping and a solid perspective on life, you can get a great relationship with a great girl. Although I haven't lived long enough to have empirical evidence for this in total generality, it must be true because of all the guys that I've met, only a small fraction have any sort of balance whatsoever. And even then, they still get great relationships. I think what this article attempts to show is that a healthy awareness for how you affect other people (a little bit of empathy), and an even greater interest in developing your own personal qualities (that aren't relevant to seduction) is all you need to be successful in the relationship scene if thats what your looking for. (It's what I'm looking for). The more time you invest on relationship cultivation, the more numerous your relationships will be, but there is more to life than just relationship cultivation (at least for me).

Chase Amante's picture

Re: Allocation of time

Author

I think what this article attempts to show is that a healthy awareness for how you affect other people (a little bit of empathy), and an even greater interest in developing your own personal qualities (that aren't relevant to seduction) is all you need to be successful in the relationship scene if thats what your looking for.

I'd say that's one fair summary, Anon; yeah.

The more time you invest on relationship cultivation, the more numerous your relationships will be, but there is more to life than just relationship cultivation (at least for me).

Absolutely. A big part of learning a skill is not generally to spend your entire life perfecting that skill forever; it's usually to learn it well enough to be able to do what you want and need to do with it, and then doing that and moving on to focus your energies on learning something new. Unless you plan to make relationships your source of income or your means of contributing to mankind, there's usually going to be some sort of realistic upper limit to how good you really need to be.

Chase

Spark's picture

Chase, you, my friend, are an


Chase, you, my friend, are an elite badass.

Chase Amante's picture

;)

Author

;)

casio13's picture

Hi Chase, amazing article. i


Hi Chase, amazing article. i really learned a lot through your articles. thanks,man.
i have a question here about kisses.
how do you make out with girls instantly? i mean,have you ever kissed a girl minutes
after you've met her? is it this what you meant by the Spontaneous kiss?
Cause i was thinking that you might get slapped kissing a girls you barely know.
if not,thanks again. I wish you a happy new year 2014!

Chase Amante's picture

Instant Kissing

Author

Casio-

The spontaneous kiss is different from an "instant" kiss - it's one you'd do once you already have some measure of connection built up with a girl already. An instant kiss, you can see some examples of here:

How to Kiss Girls in Public and Have It Go Great

... and, it basically works by walking up to a girl very slowly, making very seductive eye contact / body language / smiling at her, taking her by the hand and drawing her into you so that her body is up against yours, spending a moment of tension to gaze into her eyes, and then kissing her. Pretty simple to do in most nighttime venues if you're a little bit sexy (and sometimes even if you're not) - not every girl will go for it, but a surprisingly large number of them find this extremely exciting - it's basically harmless fun for most girls.

And as evidenced in those videos in the post above, it doesn't have to be a nighttime venue you do this in, either.

Chase

Wes's picture

Qualifying the present


Chase,

Whenever we qualify women, isn't that us telling them that their "present" is good. So what if I'm talking to a woman who has all the wrapping but a crappy present? What am I qualifying? I don't want to qualify for something that's not there...she'll even be thinking she's all that and a bag of chips when in reality, she just looks good.
Should we just lie and say we adore qualities that she actually doesn't have?

I ran into this problem awhile back when a really attractive girl asked me what I liked about her besides her looks.
I told her because she was smart (she wasn't that smart), shes witty (she was actually playing hard to get and it was annoying and her humor sucked) and she didn't believe me because I didn't sound genuine.
I'm thinking: how the hell am I supposed point out good qualities about you when you have none?
Should I just challenge the social norms and go for the close without making the girl like her internal self is "oh-so-amazing". Like you said before, a lot of people think they're special but it turns out they are the same and offer the same value as just about everyone else. What would you do?

Also, what are your thoughts on "getting in state"?

Wes

Chase Amante's picture

Qualifying

Author

Wes-

If you're qualifying her during deep diving (which is where you should be focusing the brunt of your qualification), you're going to have her telling you a lot of very deep, intimate things about herself, her character, her journey, her background, her dreams, her motivations - all these things are the present, not the wrapping, and that's a big part of why deep diving is so effective - you qualify her on her, and not on the mask she presents to the world, which is what most men do to her day in and day out.

If a girl asks you what you like about her and you start listing characteristics, you are not qualifying her; you're qualifying yourself - you're trying to show her that you appreciate her for more than her looks (incidentally, as I recall it one of the things I pointed out in a field report of yours before was that you were qualifying yourself while mistaking it as qualifying her - still doing the same thing, it seems… you need to cut that out!).

What you SHOULD do there is say, "Well, I don't know. What IS cool about you besides your looks?" and then start deep diving her and qualifying her based on what you learn about her. Don't let people put you on the spot - whenever they try it, put the spot back on them instead.

The thing about trying to fib your way into someone's heart by complimenting qualities they know they don't possess is that it doesn't work, because it's clear the person doesn't know you from Jack and is merely trying to butter you up. That'd be like if some random person wanted to come to your party, and in order to gain entry he resorted to telling you how much he liked [XYZ characteristics you do not possess]. All you'd end up feeling was, "Does this dude even KNOW me? And why is he trying so damn hard to make me think he does when he clearly DOESN'T? What does he WANT from me??"

Don't do that - it's obvious snake oil, and even if she's dumb as a rock she's still going to see it a mile away.

Chase

Wes's picture

Nevermind


Nevermind about the question about your thoughts on "getting in state". I saw your reply on the article on Empathy.

African boyo's picture

Entrepreneurship


Hi chase

Im a university student and my question is in the realm of business. I wanted to find out if you have any advice one could use to start a succesful business. Its my understanding that business is all about spotting opportunity and being able to capitalize on it. What other advice would you give that would be helpful,that isnt cliche and that one could use. I realise the obvious tips like
-getting a financial degree
-networking

But what are some other suggestions that i can actively work on to start a business. Basically what are the "fundamentals" that ensure success in business that i can actively work on

Chase Amante's picture

Re: Entrepreneurship

Author

Boyo-

I'd only consider myself a very modest success at this point so far, but off the top of my head, I'd say:

  • Develop specialized knowledge in a monetizeable field - this usually involves immersing yourself in a field, learning its ins and outs, and figuring out what the people working in it love, hate, and desperately need to make their lives much easier

  • Develop useful "hard" skills you can use to build something - could be programming to build a web app; could be writing to write a book or a manual; could be appearing on the camera to create video products and doing the video editing to make the end product look polished before you have enough money to outsource this

  • Learn obsessively about marketing - 10% of business is your product, 20% of it is execution, and 70% of it is marketing - even if you ship crap, if you get it in front of enough eyeballs and excite those eyeballs enough, you'll make money (but, don't ship crap); if you make the greatest product in the world, but can't get a soul to pay attention to it, you'll end up throwing the towel in and going and getting a day job, and the world will never get to enjoy the greatness you built, all because you sucked at marketing

  • Have a backup plan - know what you'll do for income if your business doesn't work out. Having in-demand hard skills makes this easy enough; if you're a programmer or a web developer, for instance, and you're fairly good, it's easy to make a healthy amount of income doing freelance. This is vital both for actually letting you relax and fully focus on business-building, and also keeping you out of the valley of desperation, in which you can easily make all kinds of boneheaded mistakes and be taken in by all manner of parasitic individuals in the entrepreneurship world (of which there are plenty) who are looking to make a quick buck by cashing in on your need to get rich quick

  • Find friends to talk with frequently who are also entrepreneurs at about your level or slightly above it. This provides you with encouragement, yes, but also all kinds of synergies - my social circle of entrepreneur friends has been invaluable in funneling me all kinds of (often very profitable) ideas that I'd never have stumbled on in a million years without them (and I have them). They've also proved great sounding boards for new ideas I've come up with, and voices of reason when I have some new plan or am preparing some new product or feature

  • Don't worry about the window dressing - business cards, incorporation, finding an office, etc. If you're bootstrapping and don't have funding, that stuff is irrelevant. I've been involved with 6 startups, I think, at this point; of those 6, I had business cards for 3 of them, and did not have business cards for the other 3. The 3 I had business cards for were the ones that sucked up a lot of time, a lot of money, or both, and provided exactly $0 of revenue during their entire lifespans. Of the 3 I did not have business cards for, all made at least a little bit of money, and 2 of them are still in operation (including this one)

  • DO worry about contracts if you are not a sole proprieter. If you're taking on partners, absolutely, absolutely, absolutely sign a contract together as the very first thing you do together, with very specific, very concrete deliverables for all parties, with the full knowledge that it's very possible all other parties but you may never do anything more than the absolute bare minimum that is written into the contract for them, so make sure you're happy with that bare minimum before you set it in stone, and DO have a lawyer look it over thoroughly before you sign, to make sure there are no "screw you" clauses in there you weren't thinking of (or were too nice to refuse to sign with). I might also suggest a trial run of 3 months or so for any new partnership; work together, build it into your initial contract - trial run of three months, and if it doesn't work out, here's how we split things up. You need experience working with someone before you commit

  • Make no hard decisions late at night, or under pressure. Never enter into any agreement that you aren't excited about, ever - not a partnership, not a sales agreement, not a hire, nothing. If you have second thoughts about anything, get out the moment they kick in. If you hire someone who turns out not to be a good hire, let him go kindly but firmly the instant you realize it. If you're overly charitable in business, those less charitable than you are will eat you alive

That's all I've got.

Chase

Anonymous's picture

Hey Chase, i have encountered


Hey Chase,
i have encountered an issue. I am a pretty quiet guy,which means women tease me all the time. My question is : How do you answer the question "Why are you so quiet?" or how do you reaact when someone says "Talk,say something!"

When asked by a girl say once, it could just indicate her interest to put me into the conversation albeit an awkard one (she could include me in the convo in a much more smooth way). However what if a girl asks this every goddamn time? It's obvious she wants to diminish my value and up hers etc. And she actually does, my fundementals, my vibe, everything crashes after my awkard reaction to this question or similar ones.

So how do i react in situations like that? Even if i internalize witty answers, i usually bend to the pressure and default to my weak awkward reaction that messes everything.

On another note i've read your article about reversing past precedent etc. But how do you actually do this if you are truly changed but the gal treats you the same. There was this gal which wanted me, i was dumb back then, then i wanted her but it was a case of too littte too late...

Anyway i met her again after about 6 months in a group setting, and she was unbelievably aloof, i tried iniating casual convo but it was too awkward (nothing had actually happened between as in the past so her cold reception bugged me). Whatever in the ensuing group convo, i ended up screwing it by reverting to my previous awkward self which ruined any chances.

But still i thought at least initinally her reception would have been much warmer, because i looked much better, super cool body language, non-neediness etc and not to forget she was into me a lot once (when i was socially retarded).
So how do you explain her behavior? Is she still in auto-rejection because i didn't take the chance a year ago or she now simply thinks i am still the same awkward (creepy) because i did nothing back then and tried now?

Sorry for the long post and thanks!

Chase Amante's picture

Social Circle Precedent

Author

Anon-

People will behave around you the way they behaved in the past, until you prove to them that you are NOT who you were in the past. You must act different before you are treated different; not the other way around. So even if you appear to be different, if they treat you a little like they used to and you then revert back to old you, that confirms it in their minds: "Yup, he hasn't changed a bit." And if you are switching back, then you haven't actually changed that much… or are still in the process of internalizing your new changes and make them "you" and not "what you are aspiring to be."

When asked why you're so quiet, just respond that no one's given you anything worth weighing in about, or that you're still waiting for your invitation to participate. When someone commands you and says, "Talk, say something!" just throw it back: "Like what?" If she continues to annoyingly persist, just excuse yourself and tell her you're going to go get a beer (or whatever) and ask her and the group if anyone wants anything, and make a mental note to grab her later and start escalating with her.

Anyway, she just sounds very young, and very social uncalibrated - she's probably interested in you, and frustrated that you aren't showing enough interest in her back, so she's pressuring you to try to get something out of you - girls used to do that to me in high school. I'd just smile at them, or go, "Yikes!" make a funny face like they'd just lost their minds. Sometimes I'd sigh overly dramatically.

Also, when someone's acting cold toward you, chasing is harmful, not helpful. Just get some preselection going on, and she'll typically warm right back up and start giving you positive attention again.

Chase

Alcaeus's picture

First Impressions


Hey Chase,

Good read. The wrapping and present analogy hit home perfectly. It toted my mind back to an event (in the not too recent past) about a girl I was obsessing about. She had amazing wrapping; a 104.2 GPA, Commander of Drill Competition, impeccable fashion sense, and voluptuous assets. She was my dream girl. I began https://www.girlschase.com/content/overproviding-good-feelings with complements and promises (promised her an all expense paid prom seat, and she didn't even know me). Essentially it was all bad https://www.girlschase.com/content/reversing-poor-past-precedent-girls-you. After my infatuation cooled off and I began to deep dive, sloppily over texting! She began to thwart all my efforts. I had nuked my chances of getting to KNOW her (forget getting her in my bed!).

I had let the wrapping get to my head, and it reflected in all facets of my interaction with her. I began to envision how amazing a person she should be if she has all this value and that totally scared the bejesus out of her. She was freaked out that her present would not be as good as her wrapping and that I was envisioning characteristics, traits and a personality that did not represent her but instead were cooked up by my over-enamored mind. My expectations were high and she was scared she couldn't live up to them so she avoided me. Consequently I never got to know her, (genuinely), I became frustrated and we never did become lovers.

What I'm getting at Chase is two things. Your article connected personally with me (and many others) and I would like to take it to the next level of : First Impressions.

That little parable of mine and much of your article connoted the power of first impressions. Like me, that girl is a master of it. And like her, I am guilty of shunning people once they are dazzled by my first impression. We don't do it on purpose, but more of as a defense mechanics to protect us from the disappointment if we don't remain amazing in onlookers eyes. I have long removed myself from front-loading my value in first impressions (Kudo's to this site), but every now and again I feel myself prompted to show an audience my various gifts: at a job interview, motivational speech, teaching/tutoring etc. How do you wow people with an amazing first impression and yet keep them around when you interact with them one on one?

Keep up the good work.

Chase Amante's picture

Re: First Impressions

Author

Alcaeus-

Yes, no good when you've built impressions up to unrealistic levels... only to realize you won't be able to deliver on what this other person thinks you are, because no one's THAT perfect.

The big key to this is keeping things on an even keel during that first impression; warmth and humbleness are your primary assets here. These can be bad for someone starting out who's not already making very impressive first impressions, but once you reach the point where you're consistently wowing people, it's time to take it down a notch.

Essentially what you want is to wow them, and then to hit them with the, "Oh, no, no, no... I'm not really that impressive. In fact, I'm just like you, just a little bit ahead of where you are, that's all." So, you take them up, then you bring yourself back down again - the aim is for people to say, "You know, that guy Alcaeus, he's really quite remarkable, but he's also just so down to Earth and so ordinary that's he's just really cool."

What ends up happening is that you don't get quite the social status that you'd get if you were up on the pedestal, but the impression you make is a much more stable impression, and it's almost as big as that other guy's; only, the other guy's impression is an unstable impression that can burst at almost anything once other people realize that in fact he's just an ordinary human being the same as they are (and the house of cards comes crashing down); for you, you can act like a normal human being, and that's what they already expect, because that's your role - you're not the mythological impressive guy, you're just the chill, folksy, real impressive guy, whom people can relate to and who they'll expect to have human flaws (unlike the person on a pedestal).

All this is just another way of saying underpromise, overdeliver.

Of course, the more promising you can make that underpromising (and, by extension, the more potent the overdelivery), the better.

Chase

Mr. Rob's picture

Questions on goal setting


Chase I read that post on the forums the other day when you were talking about aims vs. goals and I am about to write up a vision/goal board to put my Aims on so I will stay motivated and focused.

Quick question on goals. I know in your article on time orientation you talked about how goal oriented people that actually achieve their goals have only a couple goals. While newbie goal oriented people usually have several goals and as a result don't stay focused enough to actually complete them.

How much is too many goals?

Can you work on one big project while working on smaller side projects when not busy with big project?

For example my goals include:
-getting a girlfriend (doing a fuckload of approaches with deliberate practice),
-Completely cutting out all negative thoughts and work to have completely positive optimistic thoughts
-Continue building a better body (Already in routine of working out 5 days a week and upping my weights consistently) which is more of a habit than a project, but a project nonetheless.
-Improving my fundamentals socially to improve charisma and conversation skills.

and possibly making all A's in school but I kind of consider that a job more than a project so not too concerned here.

Cutting out all negative thoughts is probably my biggest project and once I get that handled my next most important is getting a girlfriend.
Yet I'm not going to quit approaching so I can focus on cutting out all my negative thoughts.
Nor am I going to quit exercising to focus solely on approaching women and cutting out negative thoughts.
I want to work on all these things that I've made progress in over the last year and think it would be pointless to put all my focus/energy into one thing and lose progress in another equally important area.

I was going to ask the boards but I know you have been goal setting for so long you have it down to a science. I could really use your wisdom on this subject since it's sort of driving me crazy thinking that I can only pick two of these to focus on. How do you approach this situation.

Thanks in advance!

Rob

Troy's picture

Re: Goal Setting


Hey Rob!

This was addressed to Chase but i want to jump in here and hopefully this might help you before this year has come to an end!

From what you said, i think these articles listed below should help somewhat. See below:

Time Efficiency Done Right

Deals with tips on helping to manage time and get work done faster. Chase said a more comprehensive topic on time management would be up on here soon. So buckle up and just look for that one. In the mean time read this and you might find some tips in this.

The 100 Hour Rule

You stated about not knowing if to spend all your time on many hard tasks at the same time. Hope the 100 rule article above gives you some tips.

Need Help Writing Your 2011 Resolutions

A guide on writing your resolutions with your goals and plans for the year and helping to eliminate confusion in doing this.

Goal Setting

Getting goals to give a purpose/guide and making them manageable to help keep motivation and direction.

Effort Aversion

Long term motivation article to show you what it takes and what you need to do to ensure you continue pushing past your comfort zone to success.

i hope this helps and lets see what Chase has to say/add to this. I remember out of 1 of the last 20 articles on here (or maybe chase's latest 10 articles), another commenter asked a similar question and Chase replied his main procedure for time management but i cant remember which article to point you to and find the comment he gave to give you your answer. Shoots! anyway when he replies to you HERE he'll straighten that out. All the best Rob (and ill see you on the forum)

Happy New Year! :)

Mr. Rob's picture

Thanks for the input Troy


Thanks for the input Troy though I wasn't looking to get referred to the articles as I've read them all.

What I'm getting at is I have successfully improved and progressed in all these areas over the past year and that was without having clear cut goals in front of me on a daily basis. I want to know whether or not I can work on all three goals simultaneously and achieve success.

For example I won't be working out every hour of the week just one hour a day 5 times a week.
I also won't be meeting women 24/7 just a couple days a week.
This leaves a lot of down time and so I figured it would be good to posify my thoughts when I'm not doing those 2 things (or even when I am).

Forget the fact I have school/work to balance on top for now.

Hopefully this makes my question more clear cut.

Rob

Troy's picture

Glad to Hear of Your Improvement


Mr. Rob,

Glad to hear you have improved. I'll say that yes! You can (and will) improve on all 3 things at the same time, if you stay motivated and work on them long enough.

As for the gym, i go to the gym regularly because i am a 400m runner athlete at my school. From what ive researched and what my coaches tell me, 3 times a week for a 1 hour workout at least should do to get you toned (or ripped) in about 6 months depending on your diet. So that would mean eating a balanced diet with all the nutrients and drinking lots of water. 2 tips:

1) Try to eat within 1 hour after a workout to restore energy and provide the muscles with energy to maximize growth as fast as possible. The metabolism rate is highest here so the sooner you eat after a workout, the better and faster the gains.

2) Remember to rest properly. Since you state about going to the gym 5 times a week, (most days will be back to back there) then dont work the same set of muscles everyday.

Example: Monday you work the arms.

Tuesday you dont work the arms again. give it at least 1 day to allow muscle growth and work possibly your core muscles that day.

Those are my tips. you may already know these but just incase to maximize growth.

As for seduction, im a begineer so the only advice i would have lots of experience dealing with is time management and gym workouts.

I had to look up that word "posify", and couldnt find the meaning. what does that word mean?

Anyhow, from the advice you would get id say:

1) Go out to meet girls regularly. Id say 3 or more times a week. Also, when you are out socializing try not to think of how long you've been out. For example, you go out and then say you did 3 hours of socializing when in reality you spent 2 1/2 hours walking around and 30 minutes approaching girls.

For the gym as i said earlier, at least 3 times a week for a 1 hour workout will do you great gains in the future. So go 5 times a week, eat healthy, rest properly and stay motivated then you'll surprise yourself.

And i think you have your field reports on the forum updated regularly.

1 more thing id say is having people around you who support you and push you towards your goals. I had a time in my life of having no support/anti support and i sucked, lost motivation and failed misrably. Ive also had times in my life where when people pushed me on everytime i needed them, i did very well, or personal best or if i didnt win, the world didnt seem like a bad place to be because they made me feel good. So get people around you who push you on in times of doubt and celebrate with you when you do great.

So just balance things, work hard for quality and quantity and success will catch you before you know it. I hope i didnt go off topic here but hope this helps and if this wasnt the answer you're looking for, then Chase will help you out there.

Cheers,
Troy

Chase Amante's picture

Goals

Author

Troy-

Great links to relevant posts there - all stuff I'd recommend on goals, yeah.

Rob-

Four big goals is okay, but I'd suggest you make them more specific and less amorphous so you know exactly what you're going for, e.g.:

  • Get a high caliber girlfriend I really like by March

  • Have all negative thoughts out of my mind within 5 seconds of them occuring

  • Go up 10 lbs in weights for every single exercise I do

  • Improve fundamentals to the point where people are routinely complimenting me on my appearance, mannerisms, or nonverbals

The more concerete the goals are, the easier it is to know what you're shooting for, and the easier it'll be to gauge how much progress you've made, how close you are, and when you've succeeded. The last thing you want is a goal where there's no point you can reach that you can say, "There - look! I did it."

Because you have more of them, you're likely to achieve them all slower than you'd like, but if you write them down now and refer back to the list regularly, you may find you achieve them before you know it - I just ran over a list of goals I had written down from June that I'd forgotten about but found cleaning up my desktop today, and realized I'd hit every one of them without intending to. The act of writing goals is more about setting yourself unconsciously on a path - then, once you've internalized those goals enough, sometimes forgetting about the goals (consciously), and just going where that path leads you.

Chase

glassflank's picture

Overinvesting


Hey Chase,

Great article, I was reading this and when you said about being even more strict on on thinking and talking about a girl, I got quite inspired, one of the reasons I started learning this was to escape the emotional turmoil of overinvesting.

I wonder if you could elaborate on both the importance of not overinvesting or not being dazzled by the wrapping. And also exactly how to do that, I also discovered if I talked about a girl or especially if I showed my friends her picture of a girl, I usually more emotionally involved and often lost the girl as a result.

At times I've thought to myself something like 'oh I really want to sleep with a girl with tits like this' and blew my game that way as well. Even without time to go away and think about her.

I've been overinvesting, and now I'd like to stop that immediately. I thought that I'd learn to someday get girls I really really like. But I can see now they were just girls I had sunk too much energy into thinking about. Now I want freedom from that.

Thanks man. Always very insightful advice.

Nathan.

Chase Amante's picture

Re: Overinvesting

Author

Nathan-

The best thing I've found to do is have another girl you don't really want that much that you can direct all these emotions onto.

So, if you meet a girl who's super cute, or super charismatic, or she's just got the most perfect pair of breasts you've ever seen in your life, and you catch yourself thinking about her, stop, and force yourself to think the same thoughts about some other girl you don't really care for that much. If you're fantasizing about Girl A's rack, you instead redirect your thoughts and make yourself focus on Girl B's rack. You also don't talk about or show pictures of those girls you like, either. If you need help with impulse control, just tell yourself you'll show her picture to your buddies after you've already slept with her - just one more reason to actually go through with it.

I'd also keep in mind the "risk vs. reward" ratio with something like this - if your buddies are already expecting you to sleep with her, there's a fair bit of risk there (it might seem) - what if you don't pull it off? You may end up proceeding a lot more slowly and delicately to not mess things up... and thereby mess things up, by causing attraction to expire before you ever even make a move.

This goes away once you start reaching certain levels of expertise, but until you get there, you basically want to remove as much pressure as possible from you having to get the girl, you want to remove as much time, effort, or emotion you put into her, and if you're having trouble keeping your thoughts off her, you need to channel that energy toward another girl you don't care nearly as much for (ironically, you'll temporarily start feeling nervous about this "lesser" girl, and it'll actually be kind of funny because you'll know you did it to yourself and that it's completely artificial, but you feel it nonetheless).

Chase

glassflank's picture

Overinvesting


Thanks Chase that is really awesome stuff. I tried it out and it worked already. I'm gonna err on the side of less communication and less persistence to ensure I'm not chasing for a few months and see what happens. I've never left enough space for a girl to really chase me, I'm gonna find out what happens when I do leave that space.

Michal's picture

Hello, I was thinking about


Hello,

I was thinking about information here since a commenter on Colt's article pointed something out for me too. This site was different a year ago, I cant really remember the main page, but /insights were almost the same. There was a bit longer panel on the right side of every article. When I got there by recommendation with a link: http://www.girlschase.com/content/secrets-getting-girls-move-faster

So I started to read everything from that right panel and maybe it was changing a bit everytime and was just random, I am not sure. But I navigated myself through that in a way that I read an article and then I opened like 1 - 3 new tabs in browser because I really, really wanted to read that one too. So I had like 10 unread tabs before bed every night.

And I think it is harder now for other guys to navigate themselves through all this. Your main e-book is like 400 pages, I think. And all your content here might be 3000 pages.

I am sure some guys will just ask google "how to ask a girl on date" and your article pops up. They see all these other articles and read through like I did. But then, they might not be as open minded, they might misinterpret that. You articles are good at that "first explanation, then what to do". But Ricadus has different writting style I remember how it took me like a month or maybe two to realize that there are TWO writters, not just you. I was like, ?Am? I stupid or really stupid? :-)

Anyways, you are the business man here, but I wanted to point out something that got my attention lately.

1) You launched one or two months ago some test that distinguishes the level you are at. But I cant find it on main site. I cant see a link to that on the top menu. I mean you put time into that, I think you spend a lot of time thinking about what articles you need to recommend to different people. But how are they going to find this information? Ok, maybe I am blind but :-)

2) So maybe some newbie section like, where you put link to that test first. Or maybe that first article you made, on page 71 of the blog. Or maybe new one, regarding the current status of the site. I dont know, just ideas.

3) Maybe move the "what is girlschase" on top on the main page.

4) Also expanding the sections. When I click on any section, there are only like 14 articles + 10 most popular in that section. Good thing are those 3-line long invitations.

5) About writers, you click on any name and articles pop out. Which is good, yes, but I think you guys should use it as a link for information about you. The important information like background that is needed in order to relate to what you are writing about. I mean, I experienced traumatic situation when I was 7 so I have been fighting all my life (and still am) and can relate to others in this way, personal limitations and such things. I dont mean it as stating all your siblings, where you live, number of girls you slept with. Just the amount of time you are doing this. Because there really are people, who will just not believe you. Then people, who will take it dogmtically. Then those (like me) who are open minded and think about the stuff when we read it. But it might help those who are skeptical... maybe.

6) A map? Of articles? You guys have 71 pages with 10 on each. Those sections, for example Relationship 101, there are not really the "core articles". Like relationship drama, how to build it, how to find a girlfriend, respect in relationship, rel. jealousy, understanding love, how to prevent cheating, how to stop playing games...

Those are just some thoughts I had about this. I find it hard to navigate myself through this site nad I would say it is its biggest downfall now. Because when I look at it from an educational point of view, usually people need to learn the core principles. And I think it is at your power to make this site more educational than just informational. But you are the business man here, I am just a college kid :-)

Michal

Chase Amante's picture

Site Navigation

Author

Michal-

Thanks for the feedback; it's useful.

There's a big gray banner right at the top of the homepage that leads to the diagnostic quiz - it's the one that says "How good are you with girls… Really? A beginner… or better?" But you're right, it's kind of hard to tell that's where you should start out at on any of the article pages; we have an ad running that prompts you to take the test, but there should probably be something a lot clearer that says "START HERE." I've just made a note to fix that up.

Expanding the sections - yes, I think we can do that. The site has something like 40% more articles than when we launched those tabs now, or somewhere about that. So it can probably support more content on each of those pages.

On authors - that's a great point, we need to get some real "about the author" pages up for the writers on here. I've been neglecting that, but that's pretty important. Throwing it on the to-do list.

The article map - that's a brilliant idea. I have NO idea how to make something like that, but I do think it would be really cool, and probably very useful. We have a talented tech guy who's basically going through fixing all the outstanding bugs with the site right now and making everything run faster, but I'll add this to the wish list of site functionality for us to put together and see if he has any ideas about building an article map that's both highly usable and aesthetically pleasing.

Navigation is one of the hardest things to get right building a content-heavy website. There's just so much content that slips through the cracks. One of the main focuses I had when we were doing the site redesign a year ago was to make the new site more navigable - most of the old "best of" links are still in the sidebar, and we've just added more of the top articles in there (it was never random; it was and still is all hand-picked content, although that list hasn't been updated since March of last year and we've added quite a bit of content since then). The recent articles box, the related articles box, and all the article ads in the upper right, plus all the internal linking in articles, is all designed to ease navigation… there's also the "Insights" page, where everything's chronologically ordered. The "Getting Started" eBooks were designed to ease navigation as well, although probably need to be figured more prominently on the sidebar.

Anyway Michal, I appreciate the feedback and ideas - cheers for sharing your thoughts, and I'll see what I can do.

Chase

Michal's picture

Ok, so another thing I


Ok, so another thing I observered. I think add-block for firefox blocks that big banner on main page with quiz link because I can see it on my phone. And I use it mainly because it blocks ads before videos on youtube, but it seems to block this too.

Map is usually 1 page that looks like menu made of links to articles. So I guess if you guys have 710 articles +/- here, it would be quite a lot of work to do. But it depends on how you want to do it.

Anyways, I found that the way it is made in sections with 2 line description is quite good. So at the end, maybe map is not necessary if you fill sections with more articles.

Petr's picture

Hi Chase, I have been


Hi Chase,

I have been watching some RSD videos on youtube lately - Julien and Owen, their free tour videos and other videos. They seem to run a type of game targeted for FUN. I understand that everyone has a different style but I am not really sure about his concept so I wanted to ask your opinion on it. That you should not talk about something deep prior to sex. That you should get to know the girl after you have sex with her. In one video he described how he just does 3 things: add to the fun, challenge and command. And his interactions are more interview type of conversation but during the having fun part. It seems to me as just a "game for one night stands". It definitely does not seem like a style for me. If I should guess, I would say there is this part where you should focus on her having good emotions in order to have sex with her...? I am a type of guy who is ok to sleep with a girl but I would like to have a girlfriend. And I am not sure if she wanted to see me after we would had sex like this. That type when you wake up each other and think who the hell is this anyway?

Thank you,
Petr

Chase Amante's picture

Fun Game

Author

Petr-

I'm not familiar with Julien, and I don't know Owen from RSD personally nor have I seen him game or know the kinds of results he gets, so I can't comment on either of them or their results.

My own style, and what I teach here, is based on what I learned from all my natural friends, which is basically, "Be fun, tease her, be playful, but also be warm, be sexual, and connect with her in between the teasing and flirting." Different girls take different levels of flirtation, too - some girls you will tease mercilessly from the moment you meet them until the moment you get them home, simply because that's what they respond to, but other girls you can only tease very lightly, because that's not what they like, or because you come across so high value / high status to them that too much teasing will blow them out.

The things to be careful about with being overly fun are what I highlighted in these articles:

... and what Ricardus pointed out in this one:

Basically, what I've observed with other friends who've followed a more traditional "pick up artist" path is that they tend to way overemphasize the "fun!" because it gets great reactions, but entirely miss the undercurrent of warmth, sensuality, and connection that talented naturals use with women. My theory is that this is because most guys who get into PUA need it because they aren't very socially adept in the first place, so they only catch the most obvious behaviors that successful men use and miss out on the subtext.

The main caution I'd have when watching guys who are super playful is, are they creating a sexual vibe, or are they creating a fun vibe? Because the two are very different things, and oftentimes not all that compatible. If you want to bring girls home, you want sexual, not super fun (but a little fun is good and healthy and can contribute a lot toward a sexual vibe... just not "wild crazy fun" - not usually).

Chase

Troy's picture

Privacy and Being Discreet


Hey Chase, quick question.

I do most of my field reports in a book at home since i dont have a computer to use. I always post my comments and use the forum from a internet cafe but i type up my comments and field reports on my phone then save it and send it to a computer via USB hooked to my phone and computer. I cant do this regularly because it takes too much time compared to typing on a computer and my fingers hurt after typing on my phone for so long.

Most times i write down my field reports in my journal book but of lately my parents found it where i hide it and i suspect they have been reading it. I cant say for sure but if they did, its an invasion of privacy and id get really angry.

Yesterday, i left home and left my field report/ intimate book and personal text message conversation book in my drawers because i had to rush to leave home. When i came back, they were on in another of my drawer opened up (and it wasnt a mistake from me). My family always go through my things behind my back that i find it hard to trust them. I asked who went into my drawer and no one answered me. Maybe it might be safe to say that since i am a teen that i my parents have the right to go through my things but this is my personal belongings and i have rights too. The problem is that i dont feel comfortable explaining to my parents that i want to work on my social skills because they have betrayed my trust in the past when i told them a few of my secrets.

When my parents get angry at me, it quickly becomes an opportunity to shout and tell all the neighbours and my siblings the secrets that i told them in complete confidence before. this makes me closed off/secretive of lately and i wish i could talk to them. So now that ive become more secretive towards them, they try finding out what im doing but im afraid of it becoming public announcement.

1) What should i do in this situation when i cant trust my own parents to avoid shame?

2) Most of what i post here you and the readers here are the only persons that know of my issues. Have you, Chase ever told your parents/friends secrets that they blew you out on and how did you deal with this (and how can i deal with it too when they dont care about your feelings)?

3) How do i (or you would) tell my family about interest in getting girls and seduction?

4) Does your family know that you opperate a seduction website?

5) If my parents read my journal and know all my secrets how do i react (and how would you react)?

6) How do i tell my untrustworthy family (sad to say but thats just how it is) to not go through my personal files despite what they want to say about having the right to go through my things?

This was longer than i thought but i think you get my point. thanks for the reply in advance!

Troy

Chase Amante's picture

Re: Privacy and Being Discreet

Author

Troy-

Glad to hear you'll be working on your present this year!

The problem with your family sounds like mainly one of communication. Pretty much everyone you will ever meet in your life has SOME kind of dysfunctional behavior that he is not ever aware of until you point it out clearly to him in a way he can understand. The way you'd need to do it with your parents, for instance, would be to wait for a situation where they're pressuring you to find out what you're up to, and you announcing, "No! I would tell you if you wanted to SUPPORT me and HELP me, but whenever I tell you something important to me, you just go around shouting about it to all the neighbors! You've behaved exactly the OPPOSITE of someone who wants to earn and keep my trust - the only thing you do with my personal life is gossip about it, not sit down to help me grow into a better man with it." That's the sort of thing you need to say to make them really take a look at themselves and say, "Whoa, he's right - we do do that. We're making things worse for our son instead of making them better." If they're reasonable, rational people, and you make a coherent argument, you can expect a difference.

I've had people try to use information about me a few times, either to get me fired from a job because they saw me as competition or didn't like me personally, or to extort me for money (I'm the only non-criminal I know who's had multiple individuals try to blackmail him). The only thing you can do in these situations is a.) appeal to higher ups with a more rational argument, if applicable; b.) threaten to use your own power to make your attacker's life far more miserable than he can make yours, in clear, concrete ways he knows you can do that also aren't going to end you up in prison, like beating the crud out of him, IF you have that leverage and that ability, or c.) just ignore the person if you have no other recourse, and get as far away from him as possible as soon as possible.

As for telling family about interest in getting girls or reacting to them discovering this on their own: just tell them you suck with girls, you suck socially, and by George you're going to fix it, no matter what anybody says.

Telling them to stay out of your files: I'd recommend you just buy a combination lock and find somewhere in your room you can stash your stuff and lock it away. If they don't listen to you now, they're not going to start listening to you because you yell at them - they'll just be more careful about covering their tracks next time is all.

Chase

Troy's picture

Wrapping is Me


Im a wrapping with little present. now i know why i always make first impressions then have those same persons get to know me a little then walk away and i lose a lot of connections that way. time to change that.

my wrapping: good looks, fashion, coming off as vulnerable with byronic flaws and being genuine.

my present is lacking in good conversation, proper attractive mindsets and great value.
time for me to change that. Im going to work hard this year to put the chocolate in my great wrapper!

great article! cheers :)

Troy

Harvey's picture

I saw a girl at the gym and


I saw a girl at the gym and she seemed to give me prolonged eye contact. I was walking by from a good distance away going back to my location so my questions is: if we make eye contact wouldn't it make sense to approach? I had no reason to walk by her afterwards so it seems like a direct approach would have been most appropriate. Afterwards I got the feeling like she lost curiosity because we were somewhat in the same area for 10-15 minutes and nothing happened, so she might have thought I was uninterested or a pansy. Of course if I were to see her again she might be happy to talk to me, but then wouldn't it be weak to dilly dally around and play it slow rather than be direct since it's obvious that we're attracted to eachother?

Chase Amante's picture

Eye Contact

Author

Harvey-

Yes, that's right - the moment you lock eyes with a girl, you MUST approach.

As you get more experienced with women, you'll learn to control this more, and not make eye contact until you're ready to approach. But if she tricks you into looking, then yes - you've got to go do it, if you're going to do it. When it happens, just smile, wave in a very casual way, and walk over and say, "Hi," to make it clear that you know she wants to talk to you, and you aren't going to pretend you didn't want to talk to her too.

Chase

Anonymous's picture

Cutting contact


Hi chase, your articles have helped me tons, I'm slowly coming into my own. Thanks.

In respect to your 3rd point. Cutting contact. I find myself doing this more and more when something's not what I want it to be, weather it's not moving fast enough, or she acts in ways I don't approve of, or doesn't communicate how i want etc. after I cut contact sometimes I never hear from them again, sometimes they will try to win me back. But I'm stubborn and it's to late at that point. I don't see her in the same light anymore, my attraction dramatically declines and it's on to the next.

Where my question comes in is, I believe deep down everyone knows what's good communication and what's bad and what's right and wrong to some degree.. And it changes a little from person to person. And can especially get tangled up while playing dating games. If she understood what I was okay with and not, and understood my ability to cut her off.. Final. If she's not acting accordingly and wouldn't do them in the first place. I remember you saying in an article a while back "people act only as good as they have to act" or something along those lines. Girls are probably used to guys putting up with more then I do. And having the guys give them more chances to redeem themselves if they are out of line.

Do you have some insight on how I could set this up better from the start. Having them understand what I expect and what happens if I don't get it. Before it's too late?

Thanks chase, keep up the good work.

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