Why is Mainstream Dating Advice So Ineffective?


A few weeks back, in the comments section of “Real Empiricists Test”, a reader asked the following question regarding the gulf between mainstream dating advice and what’s taught on this site:

Is there an article on this, or maybe someone can answer this outright. But why is it that mainstream dating advice is so contrary to the dating advice given on this site ? Why is it that there is almost no agreement ?

mainstream dating advice

The short answer, of course, is that what we focus on here is entirely techniques and strategies that:

  1. Achieve efficient, effective, reproducible results

  2. Are tested out and balanced against alternatives and discarded if found ineffective

  3. Are coming from people who’ve devoted a large chunk of time specifically to this field

... whereas most mainstream dating advice is coming from regular folk with limited experience dating and even less time spent studying and analyzing dating and sex and relationships and social dynamics both in the field and with other likeminded folk.

But the fact of that matter is, it goes a lot deeper than this. There’s more to this clash of ideologies than simply field experience vs. non, and it mainly has to do with who’s giving the advice, and what their objectives are in giving it.


mainstream dating advice

One of the bizarre consequences of living in the information age is the tendency of some voices, often those with little to say, to drown out most others. In the case of dating advice, the advice of vanilla-flavored non-advice on the Internet and, before it, on its forebear, television, has effectively drowned out practicable advice. Much of this comes from women advising men on dating, though certainly not all of it.

Now, as we’ve talked about on here in the past, it’s generally a bad idea to get men’s dating advice from women.

Not because women aren’t smart, or aren’t successful at dating themselves, or aren’t well-meaning. Many of the women willing and eager to give you advice are all three.

However, as discussed in the article linked to above, there are a variety of reasons why a woman is almost always going to be the wrong person to advise you as a man on how to get women (much as you might be inclined to think “Who better than a woman to teach me how to get a girl?”), though many of them boil down to the fact that women just don’t have a lot of experience succeeding with women as a man.

But it isn’t just women giving out dating advice; it’s men, too. And most of the men in the mainstream are every bit as bad as most of the women in the mainstream.

Why’s their advice just so, well... bad?


The Age of Anonymous Advice

Television, and later the Internet, brought the information age into full swing, with all kinds of information being sent out to the masses. The majority of what’s consumed is junk – “news” (really just “disaster” or “outrage” or “political crisis” templates that are filled in with whatever the threat du jour is to whip up the masses into a fearful and devotedly viewing frenzy), reality TV, and celebrity gossip websites are prime examples – but despite this, the average level of edification and worldliness of the average member of the population today is vastly higher than it was 200, 100, or even 50 years ago.

Mass media opened us up to the world in ways that were not available several centuries ago. At the turn of the 20th century, news was for the first time being delivered swiftly, telegraphed from one side of the world to the other, instead of having to wait for ship or rail or coach to get it there. Then came the telephone and radio, then television, then computing and the Internet. The way we consume and exchange information has changed so radically over the course of just a hundred and fifty years that it’s hard to wrap your head around the impact it’s had and having on us, and how society has altered and will continue to alter itself.

But the exchange of information isn’t perfect, and in some cases, it’s done more harm than good.

Prior to television and the Internet, the world was a much quieter place. You talked to your friends and family and neighbors and strangers you met in the street, and you read the newspaper, and maybe tuned into the radio every now to listen to the evening broadcast, or you hopped on the party line to chat with folks in the neighborhood, but that was it. You didn’t have the kinds of raw, deep discussions you see on television and the Internet, and here’s what I mean.

In our media today, we are bombarded constantly from every angle with instructions on how we must act and behave, and these messages come from complete strangers who do not know us.

In the past, you’d get advice on how to comport yourself, but it largely came from family and close friends and your priest and maybe a nosy neighbor or two. Advice in newspaper advice columns or serials mostly stuck to the basics: be considerate and don’t be an ass. The majority of the advice you received would be largely tailored to you: your specific situation, and what you needed to do and change.

The information age is an age of anonymity; it’s an age of legions of regular people given a pulpit on the boob tube, or on the web, to preach their views to some imagined representative viewer out there, and rail against imagined enemies of different creeds.

And as women have taken the pulpit, they’ve rapidly changed the tone and direction of this mass, anonymous discussion, and changed the way advice is given.


We Mustn’t Hurt Anyone’s Feelings Now

As private, personalized advice has gone the way of the dinosaur, one-size-fits-all advice has moved to the fore. And in a media landscape that attempts to cater to the broadest demographic range possible, that means the advice given must be as vanilla and inoffensive as possible.

mainstream dating advice

Did you know that every American broadcast television network except Fox has a majority female audience? According to the New York Times, 57% percent of CBS viewers are women. 62% of ABC viewers are.

And did you know that roughly 60% of social media users are women? Specifically, it’s 53% female on Instagram, 58% female on Facebook, 62% female on Twitter, and 72% female on Pinterest. Even MySpace still has a majority female membership. Google Plus is alone among major social networking sites with a slight male majority.

Bet you thought these things were 50-50, didn’t you. But men don’t need to chat and connect and social share and gossip and gab like women do; it’s not that one style is superior to another, it’s just that women have a larger part of the brain devoted to verbal, social, and connection, and this is where they spend more of their time. It isn’t as big a concern for men.

Of course, what that means is that naturally, every television channel that wants to be the biggest, and every social media website that wants the largest user base, is going to cater more toward its female audience than it is its male audience.

If the female audience is outraged, well, that’s a very bad thing, so the broadcasting and social media giants trend female-centric as they mature.

They might not start out that way, but they all end up that way.

Further compounding the issue is the fact that women get outraged pretty often, frequently over (what seem to men to be) small-ish things... and men do not, not nearly as frequently and not nearly as vehemently.

Insult a man on network television or the web?

Everyone laughs.

Insult a woman?

It’s a travesty!

What that means is that network and social media bosses get virtually no negative feedback when things hurtful, insulting, or undermining toward men get aired, but a cacophony of negative feedback anytime something like this airs about women.

Over time, things women dislike appear less and less, and everything targeted at mass audiences trends female in its message content.

More women disseminating information on mass channels. More women showing up to receive it. More men toning their messages down, or adopting female-centric viewpoints to kowtow to the mainstream.

Combine a bunch of advice givers meting out advice to anonymous recipients via giant channels with large reach where the culture is determined to keep things as vanilla-flavored and inoffensive to the female viewership as humanly possible, and what’ve you got?

Well, you’ve got something that’s heavy on feelgood fluff, and extremely light on substance... and something that’s very likely to lead you far astray if you treat it as anything worth paying much mind.


mainstream dating advice

Worth pounding in for good measure at this point in the article: women are not your enemy.

There is not some great conspiracy in which women have set out to rob men of their masculinity by cramming crappy advice down their throats. That isn’t what happened.

Instead, what’s happened has been a natural and inevitable result of our move to one-size-fits-all information dissemination on a mass scale targeting the largest possible demographics in the interest of profit maximization.

Our current state of affairs in the dating advice arena is the unavoidable result of TV and Internet + democracy and capitalism. It can go no other way.

Women are faultless here. Are you going to get mad at women for getting upset about things women get upset about? That’s just what women do.

Likewise, you can’t really blame the TV networks or the social media giants. If 60% of YOUR audience was female (and 90% of your complaints came from females), who would YOU be focused on keeping happy?

Getting upset and throwing around some victim mentality at how you’ve suffered and been misled by the media won’t help. Yes, you HAVE been – that’s very true.

But it’s not worth your time getting mad at them; they’re just doing what they do.

And they ain’t going to ignore their female viewership to listen to you, either.

Instead, what you must seek to do is to understand... then, to correct how you take advice, where you get it, and what information sources you expose yourself to on a day-to-day basis.


You Must Not be Sexy

When women are giving dating advice to men (and when most men are on female-centric channels like broadcast TV or social media), there are a few core assumptions you must understand that run in the veins of almost all of the advice they give. They are:

  1. You must not be sexy. If you need dating advice, it’s assumed that obviously you aren’t a guy women are exactly knocking down the door to go out with. Instead, you’re assumed to be a clueless nice guy who probably doesn’t have much hope to get with a girl aside from waiting around and hoping she gets tired of hooking up with sexy bad boys and decides in frustration and defeat to give the nice guy waiting in the wings a try instead. Most of the advice you’ll get revolves around how to position yourself to be ready and waiting to catch her when she reaches “bad boy fatigue.”

  2. You’re looking for your princess. Because the advice giver assumes you, dear imagined anonymous advice recipient, must not be sexy (otherwise, why would you need her advice?), it’s also assumed you must be looking for your princess soul mate to spend the rest of your days with... because, ew, the idea of a non-sexy nice guy like you wanting to sleep with different girls is just CREEPY... and no girl is going to tell you how to do that. No, she assumes you know your place, and you realize that, yes, while there are men women want to hook up with, that’s not YOU, honey... THOSE guys are super cute guys with hot bods and sexy accents and rapier wits. You are... well, you’re the guy who’s waiting in the wings for her to finish with those guys and decide she’s ready to settle down with someone. That’s you.

mainstream dating advice

  1. You would NEVER approach dating as a skill. Honestly, most people do not even realize it’s possible to approach dating (or most things) as a skill, and the thought of instructing someone else to do so never crosses their minds. They don’t approach it as a skill themselves (especially not if they’re women... they may read a lot on it, and take great interest in it, but because women rely on being approached, they do not go out and “practice” like we advise you do here, nor do they need to). The only women who realize that dating is a skill usually are women who’ve worked in the adult services industries – strippers, escorts, etc. Yet even many of those women are only half-conscious of the fact, since much of their learning, like that of most naturals, has come about intuitively as they’ve pursued their goals or careers.

  2. You HAVE to get the specific girl you’re asking about. This one’s a more general advice principle, and it’s an error even a lot of guys starting out in seduction will make when giving advice to friends. Most personalized advice in dating centers around situation-specific advice on how to get a specific girl in question; this isn’t as big an issue with one-size-fits-all advice coming from a mass media or social media channel, but if you’re getting advice from female friends it is. That is, when you ask about a problem with a certain girl, rather than asking themselves, “What advice can I give him that will lead him to better results with women overall?”, most people say to themselves, “What advice can I give him to make sure he doesn’t botch it with THIS girl?”

    Then – and this is the critical part – they don’t want to give you bad advice that will cause you to fail and LOSE the girl... so they give you conservative advice focused on not offending her, which almost never actually works, but never nets them any negative feedback either (”I tried your advice and it didn’t work! You lost me the girl!” – I get that here occasionally; always makes me want to slap the guy and tell him to shut up about it and go meet 10 more). Instead, the advice recipient gets this vanilla non-advice, acts friendly toward the girl in question, and spends the next three months thinking it must have worked because now she seems a little warmer toward him.

These are the primary differences between what you hear everywhere else, and what you hear here.

Everyone everywhere else is assuming that 1.) you aren’t sexy, 2.) because you aren’t sexy, you must be looking for long-term commitment and anything else would be gross and would mean you don’t know your place / aren’t realistic (because, after all... you aren’t sexy!) / don’t “get it”, 3.) you’d never approach dating as a skill, because, like, who even does that?

And finally, if you’re asking someone about a specific situation, they’ll invariably give you conservative nice guy advice that’s geared at minimizing the chances you burn a bridge with the girl, rather than maximizing the chances you actually get her, because they reason that if you burn the bridge with her, WHO EVEN KNOWS the next time you’ll meet another girl you’ve got a shot with... but if you do next to nothing and it doesn’t go anywhere, well, you can always keep trying to make an eye contact connection with her over the next 20 weeks-months-years.


Mainstream Dating Advice’s Vanilla Sound Bites

A good way of summing up mainstream dating advice is this: it treats dating like a game of symmetric returns.

And as we discussed in “Picking Up Girls and the Game of Asymmetric Returns”, that is almost always not a winning strategy.

Mainstream dating advice fills itself chockfull of vanilla-flavored sound bites that sound great but give you absolutely nothing usable or actionable – things like:

  • Just be yourself!”
  • “If it’s meant to be, it will be!”
  • “Just be confident – women like confidence!”
  • “You should ask her out!” (no details or specifics on how)
  • Be a gentleman – women like gentlemen!”
  • “Just tell her how you feel – if she feels the same way, she’ll say so too!”

Non-advice like this just leaves men scratching their heads as much after it as before it, often fumbling out a “Thanks” and assuming since she was so confident in how she delivered it the advice giver must know what she’s talking about and his confusion must be his own ignorant fault, but it’s a poor substitute for what they would’ve gotten before the information age – a family member (including a mother or a sister or a cousin or an aunt) or a male friend telling them to stop being yellow-bellied and go ask that girl to the ball... go invite her to dinner... or go drive her to Lookout Point for a night of stargazing and other private things.

This is the kind of advice that no one dares to say on broadcast TV or social media sites on the web, because it causes too much of an outrage, and leads to moral superiority shaming attempts. Even men won’t share it socially – you can get as mad as you want as studio heads or social media CEOs for not making more male-centric products, but are YOU going to go share this article on Facebook or Twitter after you finish reading it? Didn’t think so.

Best thing you’ve read all day? Maybe so.

Going to share it socially? Nope.

Because if you do, you’re probably just going to be courting negative feedback on it from the people in your social media network: “Oh, you read that Girls Chase site? I should’ve unfriended you a long time ago.”

The fact is, on channels like social media and television that cater to women first and men second, the positive feedback is reserved for things that make women feel good to see and hear and experience and consume, and the negative feedback is reserved for things that create cognitive dissonance and upset a woman’s worldview – and it doesn’t even take many upset women to generate a lot of loud-sounding negative feedback.

A handful of angry, vocal individuals is often all it takes to make sure you toe the party line next time around (something we talked about in “Bitter Women: No, They Are Not “Everywhere”” – the sad reality is, a small vocal and outraged minority of women are able to exert a great amount of control over what makes it into the media simply because the Internet gives a loud voice to anyone who wants it and is enough of a demographic and message fit to make it in the mainstream; this handful of angry women give the majority of normal, easygoing women on the web a bad name).


Can the Mainstream be Fixed?

I don’t think so, but I don’t think that’s a bad thing, necessarily.

Rather, I think what’s IMPORTANT is that people come to REALIZE that mainstream channels are going to be vanilla-flavored by nature, because they’re catering to the broadest possible markets and they’re extremely sensitive to not offending anybody. That makes them valuable places to go and consume mindless fluff, or the occasional insightful thing that doesn’t upset anyone’s sensibilities... but if you want real learning you have to step out of the mainstream.

And that goes for pretty much everything. You won’t learn a martial art going to a “belt factory”, as they’re known – those are the karate and kung-fu and Krav and everything else facilities that have cropped up all over to keep students enrolled and leveling up so they keep paying even if they don’t actually learn how to defend themselves. These places are aimed at making martial arts “accessible”... and more a workout and a way to feel good about oneself than anything else. You really have to audit a location and see how strict the teaching is to find out if you’re actually going to learn anything, or whether it’s just a mainstream feelgood jazzercise belt factory.

Likewise, mainstream investing advice. Most daytraders take their advice from guys giving investing advice on television or the Internet... all of whom, it’s safe to say, are primarily making money from their salaried TV and Internet jobs giving advice about investing to viewers and readers, not from playing the stock markets and making millions. If you want real advice here, you need to tune out all the noise and bluster here and go find successful investors to listen to (e.g., turn off Jim Cramer, who will happily lose you 7 cents per dollar you invest in his picks – by comparison, had you just put all your money into the S&P 500 over the same time period, you’d have earned an extra 38 cents per dollar invested – and go buy a book by Warren Buffett instead).

Mainstream is fluff because it HAS to be fluff. It has to be. The channel with the largest audience is ALWAYS going to be one with sufficiently-inoffensive content. There’s always a balance of course – the big guys want edgy enough that everyone says, “Oh, what a scandal that X character from Y show said Z!”, but not so edgy that any of the viewers or readers have cause to feel personally offended, marginalized, or objectified.

The beaten path, in other words, is always the safest, and it’s guaranteed to take you somewhere kind of interesting/okay... just interesting and okay enough that most people will stick with it because it’s just easier than having to go down one of those less beaten, less talked about, more grown-over paths.

Just like, yes, if you follow mainstream dating advice, you will get dates eventually... you will get a girlfriend eventually... and you’ll get married eventually and have kids eventually (if that’s what you want). She might not be the girl of your dreams, but she’ll probably be okay. It’s not so horrible that it’s impossible to ever get a girl being a pushover nice guy. It works just occasionally enough that most nice guys never really have to jump ship.

However... if you need something that works better than just some of the time...

Something more fulfilling than “just okay”...

Something better, more exceptional, and more excellent all the way around...

Then you’ve got to tune out of the mainstream, shut off the fluff, and find the unconventional.

Because away from the vanilla fluff inoffensiveness of the channels catering to the masses is where you find the real meat – the real info on how to do anything you really want to do.

So, I invite you – the next time you find yourself getting sucked into some inane television show or reading some piece of mainstream media drivel or scanning through a social media activity feed full of tweets and status updates about your friends’ and followers’ meals, pets, and bowel movement shenanigans, stop for a moment and ask yourself, “Is there somewhere better I could be getting my information about this subject instead?”

The answer is almost always going to be “yes”... even if sometimes you have to do some sleuthing and digging and path carving to find the right source.

The hunt is always worth it in the end.

Chase

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Comments

Zehn's picture

My story


Chase, your website has made a massive impact on my life, and this article explains the kind of theory behind all the change that took place. It mainly attacks the mainstream perspective, and highlights for me why it was wrong for me to follow mainstream dating advice for 25 years of my life. Mainstream advice brought me no success with women on that front, even when I was in environments surrounded by beautiful women.
I used to follow rules such as "be nice, be safe, don't make women feel uncomfortable, eventually the right one will turn up etc.". Something happened with me, and I made a change. I read online. I started taking risks with women, started to believe in myself and being more edgy, not keeping my thoughts to myself, being more honest with those around me. I understood the idea of supplication and was disgusted with myself for doing so in the past (I don't want to be supplicating to anyone anymore). I suddenly understood how effective the concept of "making women feel uncomfortable" (just strong direct eye contact, raising tension, appearing bored when I am bored etc.), which really means not hiding my sexual intent and being more honest about how I feel about the woman I am facing (whether positive or negative). Suddenly women were doing these sorts of things: trying to impress me, flirting with me, calling me an asshole, saying I am too dominating, being drawn to me due to my honesty etc. All in all, strong positive and negative reactions, as opposed to what I was receiving in the past, which was vanilla reactions "you are so nice, friendly etc.", which really meant "harmless, boring".
I am still nailing down my method. I don't believe in hurting anybody's feelings, and I keep meandering between asshole and nice guy. All in all, this website helped me, in 4 months, to sleep with 3 women, another 2 women brought home but failure to sleep with, have some additional makeouts, lose the fear of sexually escalating (and risking losing the girl) etc.
Chase, thank you, respect to you. Out of all the websites I have come across, this is by far the most effective and insightful.

jj123's picture

Multiple Items and Questions


Some good insights about mass media here, but:

1) Most male-geared dating/romance/seduction advice, at least in the internet era, comes from male figures like Louis and Copeland, David DeAngelo, DOC LOVE, etc. Now I'm sure you're too classy to insult those who can be construed as "competition," but how much of the above-described vanilla advice applies to them? I've noticed the common theme among all of you to avoid being a nice-guy "wuss," and recognizing a woman's lack of interest in sex or romance and moving on to other women, rather than clinging to a love interest as her male friend/therapist/doormat. But beyond that, how would you sum up your differences with the other advice-givers and "coaches?"

2) You stress how women are not our enemy, but that we're suffering the "natural and inevitable result of our move to one-size-fits-all information dissemination..." This includes (as you allude) women laughing when guys get kicked in the balls in TV, etc, but outraged at anything critical specifically toward females. Some of your articles seem to allude to the many outrageous social double-standards favoring women, and unfavorable to men. This seems to be more the reality. How, then, are women not "enemies" with all the gender-based competition and talk of what's fair and unfair, both in dating and in other areas of life? Why not just be chivalrous and, as a guy, always stick up for women, then?

3) There's obviously a high demand for dating/seduction/sex coaching. You've also written several articles (with others on this site) about certain foreign women in other countries, and how they're different in a more positive sense, very often. Is this all because modern American women are the ones with the "abundance mentality?" Beyond evolutionary/biological needs to find strong men to feed/protect them and their babies, that women today in our society seem to expect to find themselves plenty of men who are more successful and attractive (not to mention sexier seducers) than what's actually available? Think in terms of more women going to college, women's rising wages, fewer men in the workforce, etc...

Thanks!

Chase Amante's picture

Questions

Author

JJ-

I’m not familiar enough with the other coaches you mention there to comment, except perhaps David D., whose style to the best of my knowledge revolves principally around cocky funny / cocky comedy. He seems to have great stuff for guys who are starting out and purely for getting shaken out of that “doormat your way into her heart” mentality it appears to me he does a great job.

The problem with viewing women as “enemies”, even if you take issue with certain things they do, is that it’s also self-destructive to your own interest. Say for instance you have a bunch of people who take capitalists as the enemy, because capitalists are greedy and only want money and clearly don’t care about non-capitalists. So you rally together a group of likeminded people to overthrow the capitalists and install a communist regime. Several mass famines and reeducation campaigns later and tens of millions of your countrymen have died, including your mother and sister.

You will seldom see completely eye-to-eye with any other human being, but rather than brand anyone who doesn’t perfectly agree with you as the “enemy”, it’s usually more advantageous to say, “This person wants something different than I want. So how can I align our two interests so that we BOTH get what we want?” (incidentally, that’s also what I discussed in my article on Dale Carnegie’s advice)

As for American/Western women specifically, see this article: “What's Wrong with Dating in America (and Much of the West).”

Chase

340Breeze's picture

Mainstream = The Matrix


Mainstream = The Matrix and it's time to take the red pill of understanding.

You're right that mainstream advice sucks. They don't tell you what really goes on behind the scenes and how alot of women feel sexually repressed and are glad as fuck when they meet a man that is sexy that allows them to just be women and to let their hair down. They don't tell you that men should just assume attraction especially when you see obvious approach invitations and get on quickly with moving on a woman while tolerating the uncertainty of the law of asymmetric returns. Either you win or you lose. But you have to play to win. Simple.

Mainstream is bland in my opinion. And I know you realized you felt that way when you first started listening to Biggie Smalls back in the day and how his music compared to the "mainstream". And that's why some girls (white girls) like black men because black men aren't necessarily the American "mainstream." And I feel like mainstream writers have limited experience in what the fuck they're talking about. Like mainstream people don't tell you it's possible to meet a woman (that somehow magically and cluelessly positioned herself right next to you) in a club or sidewalk, and that you can then proceed take her home in less than 30 min after saying hi. We know that mainstream doesn't teach men to be dominant, fast moving, persistent, aggressive and have a devil may care attitude. In fact the more I vary from mainstream it's been my experience that critics get quite vocal if they figure out what I really think...so I've had to learn to just keep my mouth shut and act clueless.

But what really sucks about all advice in general is that it can't prepare you for the emotions that you will feel when you go out and experience the world. Take investing in a woman for example. You invest your time, work, energy, body, emotions, etc in a woman (or 10), and then things fall apart. Alot of these American women flake, cheat, piss you off, neg you, "test you" for weakness etc. Those things you need to experience to be able deal with them from a strong dominant frame. No one can tell you how you will feel from your own perspective in advance of spectacular failure with women. What's good about advice here on GC is the underlying reasons and perspectives that are absolutely critical for growth after a failure. The articles here are paramount for making sense of the world and adopt a new more effective perspective on the complexity that is seduction.

I've learned that you just have to go experience the world and all of the fun and pain for your own damn self. And my experience with 95% of American (east coast metropolitan) women I've met in clubs/bars and maybe 50% on the street (I don't do social circle) is that they see men as disposable items, unless your fundamentals are on lock. And even then they tend to have a replace him mentality. I don't read Cosmo or other women's advice but what are they teaching these girls? It certainly doesn't seem to be charm, feminine grace, etc. And even on the rare occasion when I find an American woman who is willing to autoinvest most times she's either travelled extensively overseas or is a 1st generation citizen who's parents are international (or did not grow up on the east coast). Maybe other guys fare better but this has been my experience with east coast American women for years...

And mainstream advice doesn't tell you how some girls really move in secret. Alot of girls out here are, in my opinion, moving more like how men move and will have multiple men in rotation. I just recently met a girl on line who had a bf but told me she thought I was cute... so she wanted to meet up! LOL! Imagine spending all your time chasing a woman and investing in her thinking she's the one, when in secret she's banging two or three other guys that she doesn't care much about? Another reason to move fast, not chase, and play the numbers game.

I know a couple guys that have been doing the seduction thing for a decade or more and they're hopelessly fed up with American women in general and particularly in the coveted mid-20 to 30 range. I tend to just keep things casual with girls I meet. I didn't start off this way, but I've found it's a much more efficient use of my time and emotions. What's happened is that out here on the east coast in city life, life is like every man for himself (or herself). There is an underlying subliminal frame of: "I don't need you" that I receive from most everyone. I don't know how other guys fare, but even after deep diving and so on, and getting to know a woman at a deep level (even if she knows little about me) the I don't need you frame still is there. And for me, my emotional system cannot get serious about a woman who operates with this mentality. I see no need to romance such a woman, like old school romance.

Then I've met a few women from overseas (Brazil, Greece, France) and they've treated me like a king. Unlike many of their American counterparts that seemingly view men as a disposable fixture in their lives, these overseas women autoinvested in me on their own volition, were much much more emotionally expressive in what they liked about me and how they felt about life in general, and were more willing to help my life become better off as a result of having met them. Contrast this with the crap that I normally experience here in my east coast city. Like I said above, much of my experience with American women tend to be along the lines of "I don't need you" or "be glad I'm doing you a favor by choosing you over all the other orbiters/potentials." And then there have been American girls who I can tell are really in to me, but there is usually an underlying insecurity that causes them to hesitate in being upfront with their emotions and vulnerable about how they truly feel. Sometimes I can be a bit aloof so maybe it's my edge who knows?? I've found that a hidden part of seduction is simply being the risk taker first in terms of what I feel for a woman... then they respond in kind. If I keep my mouth shut about what I feel, then women are more jittery and on edge around me.

Many other guys I meet (particularly international ones) have much nicer things to say about foreign women than American ones. Do you suppose the indifferent treatment that males get here is a result of "mainstream" advice for women, or is it something else altogether? I know you harp about lovers being the most in-demand men out there... but to me it doesn't matter how in demand you are and how much in awe of you a woman is, the experience isn't going to be as awesome as it could be with her if she has no clue how to treat you like a king. If you're with her for much longer than a one nite stand, then you're going to have to be willing to train her to treat you like a king.

And some girls seem to get hurt and lose interest if you tell them that how they treat you is anything less than stellar. It's like you're unimpressed with their seduction skills and some girls get offended! Others simply just don't care and will schedule the next orbiter instead. Hence the need to be non-needy around women. And my thing is why cut women slack and train them how to treat you, when they themselves want to meet men who already know what women want? Humans are wired to connect with others, and deep diving helps women feel connected to you! But connection goes both ways and in my experience women feel connected to me, but I don't feel connected to them. This happens in part because many of these girls care most about THEIR needs, and somehow/someway they manage to spin the conversation on themselves. Maybe this is the way of life for a seducer... to get people to feel connected to him while he himself feels little to connection to them...but I personally wouldn't mind meeting women who were not so self-obsessed and I could feel a connection to them too!

Because I've met a few rare women with the bod, brains, and selfless giving heart, which to me that cuts to the true point of what seduction is all about for me anyway. It felt worth even after having dealt with so much bs to find that rare gem of a girl... and hold on tight for the ride while it lasted.

But why do you suppose the treatment between the sexes in romantic liasons in America tend to suck so much? Maybe you've written about it...so if you could link to an article that'd be helpful. Some people advise that feminism is to blame, others say that men are the ones who treat women like shit so women are hopelessly guarded as a result, and others advise that the best way to maintain your power in your relationship and inoculate your self from any pain is to simply need the other person less than they need you. But what if both people apply this strategy, this to me isn't a recipe for an epic and awesome relationship.

Cheers,

340Breeze.

Chase Amante's picture

American Dating

Author

Breeze-

On the one hand, there's a "relative effect", where your countrywomen will always tend to seem colder and more ready to treat you a commodity than other women. Talk to any Swede and he'll tell you that Swedish women love EVERY man... so long as he isn't Swedish; talk to any Chinese and he'll say the same thing about Chinese women - they treat Chinese men like commodities, but foreigners like gold. Same thing in Korea. Same in Italy. Same in Australia.

That said, I've heard plenty of foreigners complain about American women in particular (though I've heard plenty of non-locals complain about local women in various other locales too... yet it does seem to be more frequent regarding American women), and I think a lot of that's due to the things I talked about in these articles:

The populace reflects the cultural environment and constraints, and in American (and, progressively, Western in general) culture, we mostly live in big, anonymous cities, with zero accountability, few social repercussions, and LOTS of potential suitors. Treating one another as commodities is the correct, rational way to run through mate assessment if you're coming at it from a "rational actor" economic view point; it doesn't make sense for a woman to remain sweet and innocent when she is immersed in an abundance of potential attractive options, each one better than the next. The environment will not allow it.

Chase

Sajid's picture

Girl's past


Dear Chase,

I like this article and that's the reason I dumped the 'mainstream dating advice' in favor of your blog an year & a half ago. I have been very successful since then. Thanx a lot Chase. But I a few questions or doubts regarding how much importance should be given to woman's past when considering her for a relationship. Some of your previous articles say that we should not consider women with a 'tainted' past as a good relationship material. I agree with that up to some extent. But I also think that people change with time. I myself have changed so much (in better ways) ever since I started following your website. Thank you again, I am not just an average guy that I used to be. Similarly what about those women who have had a tainted past but now they are on a good path and are committed towards self-improvement. For example a woman who was a 'party girl' some years ago but now she has stopped doing that and visits a church instead on regular basis. I would also request you to do an article on how to measure women like these for a relationship.

Regards, Sajid

Chase Amante's picture

Playing the Odds

Author

Sajid-

I'm of the mind that while women like this can be a lot of fun, they're bad bets for a long-term relationship, for the reasons I laid out in these articles:

Signing up for something long-term with a woman with a checkered past who's "changed now" is like buying a new home with a history of extensive fire or flood damage, that's all patched up and painted over and "good as new." You MAY not run into any problems... but the odds that you do are far greater than had you purchased a newer house that doesn't have that kind of wear and tear on it.

The problem with attempting to assess whether a woman who's done the party scene but is "past all that" is REALLY past all that is that there really isn't a way to do this accurately... much like there isn't a way to really assess whether that fire-damaged home is truly free of all damage, or you just can't see any of it. You can rule some things out, but plenty more you cannot (e.g., when the two of you hit an inevitable rough patch, or you find yourself on frequent travel, or she gets bored... will the call of freedom, flirtation, and fun from her old familiar hangouts still be something she can override?).

That's not to say you're doomed by choosing a girl with a wild past, or perfectly safe choosing a girl without one. We're talking bets and odds, not guarantees.

But if you want (much) better odds, it's better to choose a gal who hasn't been through the party scene meat grinder for something long-term than a gal who has. The brain doesn't deal well with odds once it gets emotionally involved - the moment it finds itself in love with a girl with bad odds, it pushes these to the side and "knows" that this girl will be the exception and that together they can beat the odds. So, better to make this assessment before you get involved... because once you do, it's too late.

Chase

Sajid's picture

Thanks


Thank you for your insights in this area Chase :)

Anonimous's picture

You know...


I've seen this lady at an party that was bombarded with guys; which approached her like no tomorrow! Quite hilarious I do say, to the point where she is putting up a physical barrier with her hands xD
So a little question, at what point in a woman's life does the approaching of men cause such irritation and such... scorn?

Chase Amante's picture

Liquid Courage

Author

Anon-

The point in a woman's life that happens is late at night at a party or in a bar when she is separated from friends and looks like she's there alone.

At that point, all the drunken, clumsy single men present, fueled on by liquid courage and lowered inhibitions, begin to descend on her in droves with slurred jokes and raunchy pick up lines and grabby hands, and she does whatever she can to get away.

(incidentally, this can also be a great time to pick women up IF you can present yourself as calm, casual, and relatively sober... you look like a million bucks by comparison with all her other options)

Chase

Marty's picture

This is why I love this site


My curiosity was piqued by Chase's reply to the original comment referenced at the top of the article, and now it is fascinating to see how he expounds on it in detail. A tour de force.

Being naturally inclined toward critical thinking, skepticism and non-acceptance of "received wisdom", especially "as handed down by the infant throne of the popular press" as John Le Carré once so eloquently put it, I have found a home in this site and its sister forum, where the philosophy is of exploring what works and why, and not what people would have you believe—for reasons unrelated to your well-being.

blogster's picture

A very good article


A very good article, you hit most of the correct notes and touch on the correct issues. Having worked in media and comms for governments, I can relate and you have real perception.

However, I feel you fall short of a touchdown. While it is important to focus on positive vibes and it is clearly a part of your brand, we should be a little harsher in our take on reality. Unfortunately the female-friendly media model does essentially make the media and women the enemy in many circumstances and in certain contexts.

Given the inherently solipsistic nature of women, their subsequent reactions to non-mainstream views can be forgiven as unwitting, but without a counter message explicitly outlining the flaws of the system, no progress is made on a large scale. We are simply reacting. It's equivalent to women pre-vote and pre-legal rights rallying amongst themselves to figure out how to best live within the restrictive confines.

Chase Amante's picture

Reacting

Author

Blogster-

I understand your perspective (although I'd also point out that solipsism/narcissism, while on the rise in the West, is still a minority of the population, and most of the women you will meet in the real world are quite compassionate once you get past the barriers they erect to protect themselves in urban environments where they are inundated with anonymous suitors trying incessantly to get sex with them).

My message here is, "Turn off the mainstream media and find better learning resources," rather than, "Let's fight for control of the mainstream media," because I don't see that second as realistic or terribly worthwhile. The paths to win at doing that seem to be:

  • Legislating a solution where media is forced to push a certain view point as decided by those who push the bill through the legislature - but that would presume you could even get such legislation past, despite the fact that it goes against what the majority wants and flies in the face of a market economy, where the market provides what the consumers want, rather than what the government mandates it to provide

  • Forming a coalition of sufficiently vocal individuals who will cry out in outrage every time something going against their value systems comes up, just as a minority of the female viewership does - though personally, for my money, I'm a lot more interested in building businesses and sleeping with beautiful women than staring at media all day looking for something I can get outraged about and complain to the powers that be until they take it off the air

  • Starting some sort of public-awareness campaign that goes around educating youths and other groups on the skewed perspectives of media and the need for unpopular reforms

Some of those might be worth doing... but at least for me, they're not a battle worth fighting.

It's just too easy to turn the media OFF and go live your life.

The serials of the late 19th century were mostly pure junk, and filled the heads of their readers with outlandish rubbish. But no one rallied together a group of individuals to have serials outlawed... instead, they just didn't buy them or read them, and instead concerned themselves with their business.

The thing with causes is that there's an opportunity cost for every cause you take on - the more time, energy, and money you devote to one cause, the less time, energy, and money you have to devote to another.

So, the question you must always ask yourself before going gung-ho into a new cause is, "Is this cause the one I want to devote the next X number of years and Y amount of dollars to furthering... or not?"

For me, the vanilla message of the media is something worth being aware of, but far from something I want to devote all my energies to battling to change. That may be different for you, or for others - we all have different things that are of different levels of import to each of us.

Chase

jayjay's picture

Chase, 1.) on you partner


Chase,
1.) on you partner count article, does age factor in at all, like is there differences between a girl who is 25 years old with 20+ partners and a girl who is 45 with 20+ partners,

2.)and would you say the article is generalizing(partner count one), at least that is what I imagine people would say that I am doing if I spoke out the article verbatim?

3.)Lets say a guy has a great girlfriend, everything he is looking for, though he has a career and spends time with friends and hobbies that lead him to meet all sorts of sexy gals, and he is charming and knows he can bed most women if he tried. He does not want to cheat on her though, but he cant control himself, these women turn him on and try to seduce him. How does he learn to control himself to not cheat on his great girlfriend?

Chase Amante's picture

Partner Count and Age

Author

Jayjay-

Hard to say on the first question. I would think so, but the research I've seen didn't differentiate by age, and I'm not familiar enough with older women's sexual tendencies to know how big the behavior differences are between a 45-year-old woman with, say, 22 partners, and one with 4 or 5.

The article is indeed a generalization, as are all things you can say about people. Saying, "People with educations tend to make more money," is a generalization, and so is saying, "People who marry younger tend to have more children," but just because these are generalizations doesn't make them less true on average.

As for controlling oneself and not cheating, the best way is for him to remove himself from that environment. Otherwise, there is always going to be a time when his willpower is low, he is fighting with his girlfriend, and all the stars have aligned to make it easy and put him in just the right position for it to happen. He still might say no - things like his values, any religion he believes in, etc. have an impact - but the #1 cause of infidelity is having the opportunity to stray and being around that opportunity enough for something to "just happen."

Chase

Nick's picture

Chase!Some time ago you said


Chase!
Some time ago you said this quote

"In relationships with me, women go in thinking I'm a scoundrel, and end up six months or a year in telling me with wide-eyed wonder, "You are a good man. I can't believe I thought you were not a good man," and I have to remind them of my less desirable traits to keep their feet relatively on the ground. I change the way they look at the world;
I challenge them to think differently, to throw off social convention, and to become self-reliant and independent in ways most men never would, because that would mean they become too hard to control in a relationship; I've helped girlfriends build small businesses, and handed over full ownership of business and profits to them to help them achieve a level of financial independence."

The highlighted is what would be a thrilling article to read! The How To, I know Colt did a few paragraphs in an article on inspiring women, but your process on how you let them see the world that you discovered through your trials and challenges, helping them change their lives for the better, all that stuff that you mentioned would be fantastic, though I can see it being a pretty big article, so two parts should be sufficient. =) Hopefully if you decide it would be a good article it can be done within the next few months!

Also, I have happened upon a moral quandary, I am getting into relationships with girls not for the long term, but for the experience, meeting great women and learning from them, finding new ways to see and do things, and becoming a more experienced man at relationships. The relationships usually last only 1-3 months for these reasons(also so they don't invest to much time), and I feel like I want to experience more things before I decide to have children and all that comes with it. Although, I also feel like I am using them in a way without providing what they hope for?

Should I stop getting into relationships with women knowing full well that I will not be having anything long term with them, and that it will hurt them for at least a little bit?

Thank you,
Nick

jayjay's picture

hey ick, just replying


hey ick, just replying because I have a question from Chase's quote.

The part about women thinking you are a scoundrel when entering a relationship with you, obviously you are doing this on purpose, though what kind of things are you doing that make them think that? You do things for them that other men never do, like seduce and give them a whirlwind romance on the first day of meeting, making them feel great with deep-diving, giving them great sex. How can they think you are a scoundrel when you do so many great things for them, what do you do that cancels all of that, or was the scoundrel thing an exaggeration?
Because, a scoundrel in my vocab is a very bad person, though maybe not yours?
Also why do you let them think that you are one, what are the benefits to this?

Chase Amante's picture

Relationships and Scoundrels

Author

Nick-

I can note that one down for an article, sure, but I'd have to have a think on how to teach it... that's kind of one of those things I just do, and haven't ever really had to sit down and analyze. Hm.

You're fine with short-term relationships so long as 1.) the girls you're seeing aren't desperately searching for husbands and have you in their sites for that role, and 2.) you're not leading women on and either stating or implying (through words or actions) that you're open to the idea of sticking around in a more long-term basis. So long as you're not doing anything misleading, well... she's an adult and she can make her own decisions; just make sure you give her a great couple of months while you're with her!

Jayjay-

For the "why"s and the "how to"s, see these articles:

Chase

jake's picture

Chase, first off just a


Chase, first off just a question of curiosity and not one of accusation, you are a interesting man and a lot is to be learned from how you go about things.

How come you want girls to remain monogamous to you but you can sleep with any girl you want(semi-monogamous), would this make her sad that she is not allowed the same freedoms if she wants to remain in a relationship with you?

Chase Amante's picture

Wants

Author

Jake-

Well, I could give you a verbose, fleshed-out, rational-sounding answer that would doubtless be convincing and well-thought out, but the fact of the matter is that it's what I want, and wants of this nature stem from deep within your psyche... they are you. All reasoning ends up being is window-dressing.

As for whether the girl is sad - if you run the relationship improperly, she certainly is. Of course, the same is true for any girl in any improperly-run relationship. Run correctly, you will see levels of happiness, ecstasy, and joy at being with you that normal men in standard monogamous relationships never experience, due to her having had to overcome social programming and pressures to be with you - she has committed very firmly to you, and becomes more highly convinced of your value as a mate to her than any other man she's been with before or will be with after.

Chase

Brian48's picture

Hey Chase, how's it going,


I've heard about how TV generally caters to women before. Supposedly
that's why you rarely see big breasted, curvaceous women on the tube, (compared to say rap videos or Spanish Univision that I guess are more geared to guys) because of female body envy. Idk, that's something I heard awhile back.
Anyway, my questions off topic: My sister who haves two young boys approaching kindergarten age is considering homeschooling them. What's your opinion on that? I always heard that stunted one's social growth.

Chase Amante's picture

Homeschooling

Author

Brian-

I don't know enough about it to have an informed opinion, to be honest. I've heard some interesting things - might be a better way of inculcating the values you want in children (rather than having them be inculcated with the one-size-fits-all values of your society), and assuming they participate in sports and other activities with schoolchildren, they'll tend to be properly socialized. It also may be possible to give a much better, more tailored, more advanced education to home-schooled children, though at some point they will often want to go to high school and join in with the rest of their peers. I'd need to browse a lot more literature or see a lot more anecdotal reports before forming a solid opinion on merits vs. drawbacks there, though.

Chase

dantex's picture

mode change and impatience


Hey Chase, your site started having a positive impact on my life and I got two issues I want to ask you about.
First, i work in this mode. I wake up at 5 am every second day and go to work for a couple of hours and then get back home stay for 3/4 hours and go back to work again. I like what I do and can't change the hours however lately I' ve been feel kind of depressed. I haven't figured out how to use the free time between working. Once you hit home you hit home you want to chill out but I cant switch off this working mode and there is too Little time to go round to anything serious and coming home late at night doesnt leave me with anything to do much. I live one hour drive to the center so any meetings/approaches are left for weekends only.

The thing is that even though I DON'T theoretically work all day I AM in the working mode all day long and it weighs me down. I tried to relax listen to music or read but it doesnt work. How to use this time so I couldn't feel like im at work all day and at the same time use it productively not just hitting home in the middle of a day to sleep, eat or walk about the flat pointlessly?

Another thing, sometimes when I work on a new project which involves a lot of stages I so want to see the final effect asap that I rush through it very quickly and I feel this adrenaline inside me like I really have to finish it RIGHT NOW or I will go crazy. Its sort of unpleasant and extremely draining its like there's an article you want to write for instance and you want to make it perfect and you keep thinking of something really good and you want to finish it right now because otherwise you will be thinking about what else you can do to make it better and you feel this incredible rush as if somebody was to steal all your ideas if you dont wrap it up in five minutes. Do you know what i mean? It's like imagined competition. What is that? I called it impatience but im not that sure it is actually what I think.

Chase Amante's picture

Work, Impatience

Author

Dantex-

I read an article on these new work schedules more and more employees are using with hourly workers where they break up the day to avoid overtime charges or some such... sounds like this is that? Anyway, the conclusion the article came to after doing the research was that even though the workers had a few hours off in the middle of the day, the psychological effect on them was the same as if they'd worked straight through. The mind just really can't deal with a short time off in between two large shifts.

When I was working 8 to 10 hour days in the corporate world, I'd still be going out many nights, so personally I'd have used a schedule like this to catch up on sleep in the middle of the day (which I did anyway at my desk), or hit the gym and then maybe get some more sleep. You're in a holding pattern from work, and there isn't really going to be a way to shift out of work mode, so probably better to find something else to do like sleep or gym... plus, if you're getting more sleep in the middle of the day, you can get away with going to bed later, which means you can use your nights as your productive time instead of trying to shift modes during a 3 or 4 hour break.

The impatience to finish things... I think I understand. Maybe more like you've got a lot of ideas and you just want to get them all out before what's in your head becomes a jumbled mess? If you're in a creative endeavor, many times it IS best to work this way - just sit down and do a brain dump; however, the part you're maybe stressing out about is trying to dump it all out while getting it perfect the first time. When you're doing an information or idea dump like this, it's often better just to get everything out first, then take a little time off and come back and clean it up and make it perfect once you've calmed down later. Get the ideas out first, then make it all look neat and tidy after the fact. This is how many great novelists write (just write as fast as you can and get it all out, then shove the book in a drawer and don't look at it for weeks or months until you're ready to come back and clean it up with a fresh perspective), and they produce some great works this way.

Chase

Balla's picture

Looks, Fundamentals, and getting better


1.Chase, do you have any advice on making your face more attractive? I know you have the facial expressions article, but what about the face and skin itself. I can't grow facial hair, so what else can I do to make my face more attractive? I have some deep wrinkles how do I lessen that?
And what kind of facial wash or lotion do you use? And what would make African American skin look better?

2.How do I train up my fundamentals? I've probably asked this before but, how do you train them and get them better. Like how you lift weights to get stronger, what exercises can you do to get fundamentals stronger?

3.Speaking of fundamentals, I see mines are getting better. The funny thing is though, that I feel like im doing the same shit as before. Girls are just more open to me and I catch them looking. My fundamentals are getting extremely better with white women, they like me more now and their way easier to pick up than they were before when I use to write about them in the past. I don't know how to explain it. It's like you keep pushing and then you end up getting so much better at the end. I still can't explain it though, I've been doing the same stuff.

4.I'm in my early 20's chase and I feel im getting old. I want to be at the level where you're at, even higher if I can. I want to be able to do this like breathing and still also focus on my life goals at the same time. How can I do that?

5.I want to become a master at picking up women so that I can be apart of this site and help others, I want to work with you in the future. Lets just say im at zero lays and im horrible socially. What do I have to do today and everyday after to be able to get as much experience and lays as possible?

Thanks

Chase Amante's picture

Re: Looks, Fundamentals, and getting better

Author

Balla-

Can’t say I know much about wrinkles… but women like a seasoned man, so I think you’re okay there. I use nothing on my face these days but water - my skin’s improved dramatically since my soap-using days, when I used to get dry, powdery cheeks and pimples in the creases of my nose. Try it out for a few weeks… you might be surprised. Aside from facial hair, your hair cut has a big impact on how your face looks, as do facial expressions. Clothes, to a lesser extent, can have an impact on how your face is perceived; losing excess fat has a very big impact (20 lbs. overweight vs. slim and trim makes for a dramatically different jawline and neck area).

Good to hear on your improvement with fundamentals. Training these is just making yourself do things a certain way until that way becomes your new way of automatically doing it. e.g., if you slump your shoulders, every time you catch yourself doing it you straighten your back, until one day you quit reminding yourself to do it because now that’s just your default posture, and you’d have to consciously work to put yourself in a slump.

And, if you want to get very good with women, you’ve got to sit down and do the homework in the ebook, or the newbie assignment on the boards, or the tasks in the eBook you get from the diagnostic quiz, and finish all of the tasks for your path of choice, and after that start setting new goals and objectives for yourself and going out and doing them religiously. You can’t wing it, otherwise your progress will be slow, sporadic, and invisible. It might seem annoying to follow something structured when you’re starting out, but once you start knocking objectives off your list it gets pretty fun pretty fast… and YOU start improving a whole lot faster. But so long as you float along and just do what you feel like, that doesn’t happen, because improvement only comes fast when you’re consistently doing things that are right on the edge of what you know how to do now and what you feel comfortable doing. Try to do things too outside of your reach, and you’ll just fail and feel depressed; don’t push yourself hard enough, and you’ll stagnate. Real progress lies at the boundary between what you can do and what you simply can’t, and the more you live in that region, the more quickly you advance.

Chase

Balla's picture

Going on another break


It's that time again that I have to take a break. I made this a separate post so it can be easier for you to read and explain, since I have so much on my other comment.

What I want to ask about two different number pulls from nightclubs and how to get the girls to come over my house or at least want to see me.

Can you give me text conversation examples or call examples I can use to get these girls over my house after the pick ups

Scenario 1: I get a girls number without even having a conversation. I just get the number and leave, or she gets mines and leaves. Sometimes we talk after, but it's very very long time texts. Sometimes days. What can I do to get a girl over my house if I pick her up like this?

Scenario 2: I have a conversation with the girl then get her number. This is a higher rate for her to at least open up about a date and have her talking to me for 2 days. How do I get this one over?

So, basically the girls are very cold to me after the pick up and I have no idea what else I can do. I follow your guidelines 100%. But no luck.

I'd really appreciate it if you could show me examples of what Chase Amante would text and say to these girls to get them interested in seeing you and coming over.

im going on my hiatus, wish me luck.

Thank you for everything!

Peace,
Balla

Chase Amante's picture

Texting for Dates

Author

Balla-

With the first one, where there's no conversation before swapping numbers, you have to call to build some semblance of engagement with her and get her intrigued in you. See this article for how to do that: "Tactics Tuesdays: Making the First Phone Call to a Girl."

On that second one, that's the standard way to get a phone number, yes - just make sure you're telling her you want to meet up with her for food or a drink BEFORE you take the number, otherwise you're shooting yourself in the foot for no reason. Assuming you are, follow the framework here: "How to Text a Girl." If you are not, read this one and see why this is so important to do first: "How to Get a Phone Number from a Girl Every Time You Ask."

Best of luck on your break - make sure you replace the time you spend consuming material with meeting cute women in real life instead!

Chase

Anonomynous's picture

I have been having a problem


I have been having a problem lately, I was at a get-together with my girl and a new friend of my girls was there, we knew each other for a few weeks, we were both talking and my girl is across the room talking to another girl. I decide to go sit and the new friend pouts and says now she has no where to sit, so she plops on my lap very close to me, we then talk about things, funny things and I laugh out loud. That must have been when I caught my girls attention, after about ten minutes I go to use the restroom. Any way all was peaches until me and my girl got in the car to go. She is furious at the girl, but.. also with me. Now those two are arguing and me and my girl are arguing. I just want to know how to get past this? how do I make me and my girl good again, and I want them two to remain as friends as well, ..... so how do I fix this? how do I get out of a situation when a different girl sits on my lap? I just don't want to hurt any ones feelings and so I just let her sit on me.

Chase Amante's picture

Girlfriend's Flirty Friend

Author

Anon-

When out in public, especially around a girlfriend's friends, it's very important to keep in mind how your behavior reflects on her in her social circle. If you're established as her mate and you're seen flirting with other women, as you were here, everyone's going to talk behind her back about how she can't hold onto her man or how she's losing her guy to one of her girlfriends. Makes her look quite bad, and her reputation suffers for it.

If she brings it up again, just tell her to be quiet for a moment and listen: you thought about it, and realized that it made her look bad, and you're sorry; the friend just came up and plopped down on your lap and you were like, "Uhh, okay," but now you realize you probably should've just stood up and walked away. Then tell her anyway, that's the first time that's happened to me, so cut me a little slack here, I wasn't exactly expecting to have anyone drop down into my lap, man or woman.

Don't apologize beyond this or try to make it up to her; just tell her you realize why she's upset and that it's a reputation risk for her, and you'll do a better job of protecting her reputation in public next time.

Chase

creek.steven's picture

to drink or not to drink


Chase what is your take on drinking in social meetings? I read somewhere here you don't socialize that much these days? I've been thinking about my social life lately and it's pretty much non-existant. Maybe I'm a little like you, I don't like to wast my time so spending every night going out, shooting the breeze is not for me today as I'm focused on other things in my life that suck up most of my time.

However, at times I'd go out to reset. The thing is I work in a capital city but I don't live there. My town is about 40 min drive from the capital. Most of my colleagues these days live in the city and I'm sort of excluded from all the parties. Sometimes somebody mentions that we should go out but the topic is quickly dropped. Why? Beacause everbody who goes out after work wants to have a drink to chill out, relax and the public transport between my town and the city is poor especially at night so they know I'm always glued to my car. They drop the idea of going out with me beacuse nobody wants to have another coffee after work.

Today, I felt kind of sad because I talked to one girl at work how we should all go somewhere after work one day and she'd mentioned it even before but I didn't know what to tell her. I mean I can go out with you guys but I'll be drinking coffee - you know sounds like I'm a wet blanket. Then I suggested going out to see a movie and she said - sure it's a good idea. And today everybody was kind of sleepy and slow at work and I asked them what's the matter and they said "oh we're hangovered" so they told me how they'd gone out last night and got pissed. I joked "how come I wasn't there" and one girl said "oh we thought about you but you live so far and we kind of decided to go spontaneously". I've had many situations like that.

I know there are taxis but they are really expensive and I could afford to take a taxi but only if I knew the meeting is going to be long, you know when we are sitting all night drinking then it's worth it but sometimes they decide to go at the last moment, knock back two beers, have fun and after two hours they go home. So I don't want to spend so much money on a two hour meet up. How can I arrange a meeting myslef and invite them and make sure we're going to spend a healthy chunk of time out?

It really looks like alkohol is such a huge socializer. When I'm on a date I also drink coffee. I have this impression that coffee is often associated with business, work and I had a couple of girls already propose on a date we should grab some beer or drink. Obviously boozing doesn't make a great date, to the contrary, but enjoying a couple of drinks or beer would relax us and maybe even put the inhibitions down. I personally think, if I'd had some alkohol on some of my dates before, more of them would've ended up with sex. Coffee always keeps it a little bit on a formal level.

Maybe it's just misconception but I have this idea in my head that people go to parties, meet up regularly, trade banter and get laid.
And there's me with this coffee. Yeah, let's meet up and have sixth coffee today.
Once, I had a date which was going well and this girl wanted to drink and spend more time with me so we had four coffees. I'll sooner get a heart attact rather than laid.

Am I getting it all right, can I blame the alkohol or it just grew bigger in my head and my idea is flawed?

I fancy one of the girls at work but work seems to be not very conducive to approach her and on the negative side if she rejects me it's going to be awkward. Such meet ups could give me the possibility to go out, relax with her, peel her off, all of that on a neutral gound, at least to start off.

Today I got back to my town, to this flat, played a movie and felt like I'm so finished and I'll die in this back of beyond. And I only have to live here for financial reasons.

Chase Amante's picture

Drink or No?

Author

Steven-

My general thoughts on drinking are here: "Sex and Alcohol."

You certainly don't HAVE to drink, though in certain social situations it can be kind of weird for you if you don't (everyone else gets loose and uninhibited, and there's you still standing around stiffly sipping at your latte). If you don't want to drink, it's usually better just to avoid the wilder parties, though if you want to push yourself you can go to them anyway and just pound energy drinks - when I go through non-drinking periods I sometimes replace alcohol with RedBull or Monster while out and still get a sort of buzz going on (though if you pound too much of it, careful you don't get twitchy).

You don't have to announce you aren't drinking when they ask if you want to come to a party / happy hour; if you do, people will assume you're just saying, "I don't really want to go," and are just using that as your excuse, so will leave you alone. Instead, just be happy for the invite, and when you get there order a Coke with a lime in it. If anyone asks you about it, just let them know you cut back on alcohol because of whatever your reason is.

I'm not a coffee drinker (can't stand the taste), so tend to drink hot chocolate or tea when I'm out on dates... and I agree, drinks like these have a much less formal / rigid impression than what coffee does. Coffee to me has "chained to my desk and this is the only way I can stay awake" written all over it (even if plenty of my entrepreneur friends are coffee addicts too). But personally, when inviting women out for dates, I've always preferred suggesting a hot chocolate or an ice cream... it's just more playful, unconventional, and less clichéd / business-like than a coffee date, which sort of sounds like you want to meet her and interview her to see if she's a fit for the position you're looking to fill in your love life.

That's just my impression though, and that's all anecdotal. Alcohol will make things easier, BUT you can learn to sleep with women just fine without it as well. I prefer meeting women for dates during the daytime with no alcohol involved and simply ramping emotions up enough that we can sleep together after this. Alcohol just makes things too messy... is she too drunk to sleep with now? Is she going to pass out or throw up? Is she even going to remember tonight tomorrow? The more you can skip it, the more you can avoid having to deal with those questions.

Chase

V's picture

Being extremely successful/ getting off your ass


Chase, I don't mean to ask the same questions over and over again. I honestly forget I ask them and I even try to find my past comments from different articles. I find some but there are so many articles. I think a comment searcher by name would be marvelous. Like I can type my name in a search engine and see all of my comments.

I thank you for your replies, and I always dream and think about being a big success.

Im almost 30, I have the work ethic, I just started late with everything.

My question may seem kind of vauge, but how does one become extremely successful as you say?

How do I get off my ass and stop being afraid of failing and start chasing my dreams?

I know you say you have to have 10 years under your belt to be extremely good at something. But soon I'll be in my 30's and that's too old to do what I want to do. I want to be a professional athlete. No one wants a 30 year old man that's not above 6'0.

Anyway, im still going to try to reach the stars.

So, how does one become successful if they're about and how do you chase your dreams and make it into a reality?

If I can't make it in sports, what can I do?
What can a almost 30 year old man do to achieve the success you speak of? Im talking about starting from scratch.

Thank you!!!!!

Chase Amante's picture

Success and Recovery

Author

V-

Noted on the comment search engine… we’ve had requests for that before. It’s something I’d like to get set up, yeah.

On success, the question you’re asking are extremely broad. How do you define success? Is it a happy life? A meaningful one? Whichever one of those it is, how is THAT defined? Is happiness all the women you can sleep with? Freedom to travel wherever you want whenever? 20 awesome children? A summer home in the French Riviera? Is meaning contributing to a great cause, like your society or religion? Or is it inventing something that improves the lives of millions? Writing that great novel that changes the way people think about life, love, and adventure? Is it dying on Mars, like Elon Musk aspires to do, or giving away your billions, like Warren Buffet plans? Is it being remembered down the ages, like Gilgamesh or Abraham or Siddhartha? This is very different for every person on Earth; the best I can do here is point you to this article as a starting point: “The Purpose of Life from a Practical Point of View.”

There are a million things you can do that might be considered success, but I can't tell you what those are, because you're a lot more likely to become disillusioned following a path someone else has set out for you than one you've embarked upon of your own decision and volition.

On motivation, see these articles:


On alcohol, I'd recommend not drinking as much next time, or coupling your drinking alcohol with drinking an equivalent amount of water at the same time (you'll get drunker twice as fast, but you'll also sober up a lot more quickly, and won't get nearly as hung over). I'm not sure what you do to bounce back after throwing up in front of a girl you like... I only had that happen a handful of times when I was 18 or 19 or so, and I learned my lesson and quit doing it. Best thing I can tell you is just act like nothing happened, and shrug it off if they bring it up, or agree and say yeah, I've got to go easy on the tequila pre-gaming.

On texting a stale number, see this post: "Check-In Text If You Haven't Texted in a While."

Chase

Troy's picture

Motivation


Chase-

I just read your reply to me in "At What Point Do You Give Up" article. It was a rather lengthy reply so thanks much for that, it helps, but one thing bothering me now is getting back my motivation - I stated that but i guess you genuinely overlooked it since you are a busy man.

Anyway, with my tablet pc being stolen, i just feel like a old piece of rubbish. I learned a few things from this situation though which are:

1) Always walk with my bag at school
2) If possible, use my tablet at home and dont carry it out with me
3) Be less naive and on the look out ( not in a bad way, just moderately )

It's great that i learnt something from this but ive been very hard on myself and anti-social since my tablet was stolen.

I dont want to justify it but the reason is because where i live, life is hard for me financially, mentally, and emotionlly. Despite all this hassle, i saved up my lunch money EVERYDAY from January to March and i even WALKED about 2 miles home after school ALMOST EVERYDAY just to buy my tablet pc.

It is just extremely hard for me to know that after spending 2 months hungry and sweating tirelessly as i walked in the sun just to buy my tablet, to have it stolen. What a birthday present for me? wow and im 18 now and having the WORST BIRTHDAY EVER. This just shows me that i have a lot to learn about life. I dont want to get all caught up in victim mentality but i think it's worth saying that as a little boy growing up, my parents would keep me locked inside the house while everyone else in the hood went about learning how to make friends; even ehen i went to school, my parents would tell me that its a waste of time to spend recess time playing and instead i should use that time to read and study so i lost 14 years of learning to socialize. Thats the past but its not easy to just simply remove the problems.

Persons have told me before that when they look at me, i just seem like a walking easy target to get something from; because of that ive always been fearful of buying anything too expensive. I guess maybe its because i am skinny, have uncomfortable facial expressions when anxious and im going through serious traumas at school and at home.

It's always been my greatest desire to push the boundaries and succeed in life and i dont mean to complain here.

Questions:

1) How do i recover from ostracism, and im talking about 14 years of my life i've been rejected? I spent all my life up to 18 years old now without friends and being bullied and shamed. Over the past few months i havent being attacked and i have started to make friends so that means im getting better. But, i just cant get over the pain. how do i feel worthy of being someone important, loved and stop holding a mental brakes of thinking that the new friends i meet will turn against me? How do i Forever change my feelings of being hurt?

2) How do i learn to control and keep attractive facial expressions and become a person who no one takes for granted/a joke?

3) Most importantly, how do i get back my motivation after losing my tablet and continue to feel social and improve with girls? If i cant write field reports on the boards for a next two or three months, how do i track my progress? How do i stop beating up myself after a major loss? How do i not look at this loss and use it as a stepping stone instead? Its just makes me extremely angry and feeling hopeless every day since this occured.
But i should say that im not looking for sympathy, just a few tips to get back on track.

Thanks!

-Troy

Chase Amante's picture

Re: Motivation

Author

Troy-

I think I'd suggest that you take up training in some kind of martial art. That's going to help with a lot of things - the bullying, the confidence/motivation, the fear of being stolen from - the more you feel like you can whip another man's ass if it comes to that, the less heavily these things affect you. This also gives you a much more realistic perspective on the world, on your own capabilities, and the likely capabilities of any attackers you might face.

You also need to develop better threat awareness to not have stuff stolen from you, but that's something that only pain teaches you. It sucks to be going through it now, but realize that the only reason the other folks around you aren't having to too is because they already went through it when younger and had things taken away from them. Everyone experiences getting screwed over by people they don't even know at some point (having something stolen, having some nasty rumor spread about you or graffitied into a book or a wall or a piece of furniture, etc.), and the thing that sucks most about it is the feeling of powerlessness. The only thing you can do with these is to limit the ability of others to take from you (see my article on street smarts), increase your threat level to others to make them think twice before messing with you... or just stay away from places where that kind of nonsense goes on. I'd suggest moving somewhere you don't constantly have to be on the lookout for your belongings once you're out of school.

Chase

Troy's picture

Sweating


chase

where i live is in the tropics and is hot. most days after i leave the house immediately after taking a long cold shower, i start sweating like mildly (sometimes a lot) after about 30 minutes.

when i get sweaty, i feel sticky,uncomfortable and i feel that my appearance (fashion, facial expressions) get unattractive

what can i do to feel confident after i get sweaty?

how do i stop making uncomfortable/awkward facial expressions in these situations?

how do i calm my nerves when put in the spotlight in situations like:

-surrounded by a big group of girls who are looking to me to keep them interested (and how do i control my vibe around them)

- A bunch of people talking to me and asking me lots of questions that are seeming to be made a joke about me

Thanks
Troy

Chase Amante's picture

Sweating, Newbies

Author

Troy-

I haven’t dealt with this personally, but if I found myself in a similar situation I’d just focus on trying to have as many normal conversations with people while drenched in sweat as possible until I got so used to it it didn’t even register enough to shake me anymore.

Re: the unsexy article - hugging is generally a platonic thing, unless she’s your girlfriend. So, it’s perfectly fine if you want her just as a friend… it is NOT fine if you want her to retain sexual interest in you. Unless you’re going to hug her like a sexy man, of course… which is to give her sexual looks, a sexy smile, motion her over in a very sexual way, and rub her very suggestively while hugging her… then invite her somewhere alone with you soon after to complete the escalation. But that isn’t how 99.9% of the men who hug women use it.

Making girls laugh is not bad if you’re doing it right; if you’re using it at the right moments in an interaction, and in moderation. If you’re doing it lots, or doing it just to be silly or funny, or because there’s tension and you don’t want there to be tension, which is what many guys do, you are, again, removing any shred of sexual intent there and setting things up for her to see you as platonic, and nothing but platonic.

When you cut contact… yes, that’s the idea. You cut contact in order to NOT have her in your life anymore. Cutting contact is not a technique to have girls get back in contact with you anymore. It’s to boot them out to free up your time and energy to meet new girls. If you’re still running into her in social circle all the time, as you may be in high school, it’s probably a different ball game. Anyway, if a girl is ignoring you when she walks by you, you’ve blown it with her - time to move on and meet new girls and start fresh.

For guys who are VERY new and do not have much social awareness developed yet, this article is very worth a read: “Learning from Reactions: Developing Social Calibration.” It’s going to take you down a different road than you’ll go down with more advanced beginner material, but when you’re just building your awareness you need to do this first, as trying to get good with girls with low social awareness is just a never-ending slog. So yes - build awareness first, seek to be sexy and sexual after. Crawling before you can run and all that, you know!

Chase

Anonomynous's picture

Chase, If I perform in things


Chase,
If I perform in things like s&m and bdsm where I am the submissive and she is the dominant will she think I am less of a man outside of sex or inside? LIke she will start to control the relationship, or she will think I am weak?

Chase Amante's picture

Being the Submissive

Author

Anon-

From what I've seen of these relationships, the woman will typically take additional lovers when her primary man is submissive, but she will still enjoy what she has with you, and enjoy making you submit... since many men will not take this role with her and allow her to fulfill dominant fantasies. It does seem to cause some respect issues IF you do not seem to know your place (but if you submit properly, often not, because the roles are defined and both partners know them and respect them); you will almost certainly not be the one in control of the relationship - sex is the core of a romantic relationship, and how you are in the bedroom with one another determines how you are outside of it as well.

Assuming you're not in a committed relationship right now, I might suggest that if you're very intrigued with the idea of submission, perhaps try it out with a girl you aren't super serious with. You may discover that giving into your desires here provides you with exactly the kind of relationship you want and need most, and other concerns go out the window once you're getting it.

Chase

Wolf's picture

Fundamentals trump all


Chase, does fundamentals really trump everything?

I know it helps with women, but how do you use them for what I've been talking about? (Stuff about people trying to embarrass you)

Could you tell me how fundamentals really trump all of those negative things?

Can you give me the exact articles to read on fundamentals?

How do you practice fundamentals?

I also was reading the comments and you said you try to do day game in 2-3 minutes.
I thought I read 10 mins somewhere, but I guess you meant the longest convo should be 10 mins.

How do you run day game in 2-3 mins? That sounds like deep diving would be difficult.

And how do you stop a girl from what she's doing without being socially retarded?

Im talking about being on the phone, listening to music.

This girl and I were the only ones in the gym and she had her headphones in and I did as well.

How do you approach a girl like that? I didn't approach because I really didn't know how to and I remember in your gym article, you said don't approach the first time and get familiar.

Thanks

Chase Amante's picture

Fundamentals and Exceptional Older Men

Author

Wolf-

From everything I've seen, yes. If you put a man with great fundamentals and nothing else to his name next to a man with a billion dollars but terrible fundamentals, or a man with movie star looks but terrible fundamentals, the first man will win nearly every time (except perhaps around some hardcore gold diggers!).

Check out these articles for links to a bunch of articles on improving your fundamentals:

If you're doing street stops, I'd typically recommend 2 to 3 minutes unless the girl is open to going somewhere with you, yes. In the former case, open, trade names, banter a very little bit, check her logistics and run a compliance test to see how interested in you she is and willing to go along with you then and there, and unless she's burning hot or you're leaving town tonight so no time to meet up with her later, stop then and tell her you want to meet up with her later and trade numbers. If you meet her somewhere less rushed, you can take longer and do a little deep diving, sure... but some places, like walking together down the street while she's on her way somewhere, aren't terribly conducive to the technique.

If she has her headphones in, just make eye contact, smile playfully, and gesture to her to take them out by pretending to remove headphones from your own ears.

Once the headphones are out, then open per usual (but you'll normally need to go direct here since you've already started off so bold).

Starting a business is one of the least "lucky" things out there - although whether that business is successful or not certainly has some degree of luck in it. As far as what you can retire from in your early to mid thirties, could be the sports or entertainment industries, could be a moderately successful startup business that you've sold for several million, etc.

If you will never own a business, never retire wealthy, and always be mid-level at best in your career, it might just be the case that younger girls will be off-limits to you. When it comes to older men, they're looking for the exceptional older men, and if you aren't that or don't seem to be that they usually won't be interested. There will still be a few younger women who have an older man preference, but they'll be comparatively harder to find. The one exception might be if you are both extremely good-looking and extremely charming with very tight game... I've met a few older men who were basically unsuccessful bums but who managed to sleep with younger women by virture of their looks and game alone. Another might be working in an area that puts you in an authority position over younger women - e.g., as bartender, nightclub manager, doorman, model talent scout, model agency manager, lifeguard, etc. Especially if you have a good body (again, another form of being exceptional) you should be able to do okay here.

Moral of the story is, if you want younger women when older, be prepared to work for it... and if you don't want to work for it, well, you've been warned ;)

Chase

V's picture

Recovering after too much liquor


Hey Chase, I just couldn't hold my liquor. I didn't feel like a drank a lot, but I don't drink that much. But I digress, I ended up throwing up in front of my friends and a girl that I want to hook up with. I feel a little embarrassed. I want to know how do you come back from that smoothly and do I still have a chance with her after that?

Thank you!!!

Anonymous's picture

Outliers?


Your advice is a sham, Chase.

Haha jk, I don't think it's a sham, but at the same time, there are so many unknowns that seem to contradict pickup community advice. The community in general supports the concept of the alpha male being the most attractive, although what makes an alpha male is still controversial. The problem with advice is that people think they know everything or that their advice is the answer to all a person's problems. No one knows everything and not one strategy will work all the time on everyone (and it would be hard to operate in life if people didn't have beliefs). Add on the fact that most of these gurus are snakeoil salesmen themselves (I don't think you are one of them), the problem is hugely exacerbated. There are nice guys (and let's just call a nice guy someone who isn't an "alpha" or someone who has strong sexy fundamentals, i.e. he doesn't have to be a complete loser) out there who are successful with women. Perhaps high quality women are attracted to a variety of men and prefer to settle with a non-alpha since the lifestyle and level of pressure included with being with one of these guys tends to be more emotionally draining. Sure, women are attracted to alphas but a lot of the time they know it's just for fun and they wouldn't really want to be in a relationship with one. You also mentioned that people crave different emotions in a cycle.

How much control does one have over attraction? I'm guessing you've seen the research arguing how attraction is related to something as precarious as an individual's scent or how a person reminds one of someone of something attractive from one's past.

I've recently been reading/watching a lot of media and have come across those celebrity odd couples. If you search for Christina Hendricks and her husband, there are countless cries of confusion and frustration from both men, and women I think. She is one of the most desired women on the planet, and could probably have most men she wanted but chose someone who other people are calling a big nerd/loser (even if he is an actor). Apparently, she was a tough goth in high school though, which may explain the rebelliousness or different taste in men. It reminds me of another female celebrity who seemed like an ugly duckling (possible difference of confidence level or value system affecting choice of mate?) and is married to a non-sexy guy, by your standards. So, what is going on here, and why would women be attracted to men who have sort of a negative social value (if the rest of the world thinks her partner is a big loser?) Doesn't this contradict one of the cornerstones of the pickup community?

Chase Amante's picture

Alpha Men, Attraction, and Dominant Women

Author

Anon-

The word "alpha male" has gotten twisted around over the past 3 or 4 years in the pickup community into meaning something entirely different from what it actually means, or what it means to anyone who isn't a hardcore PUA / manosphere reader (that is, the man who is the leader of whatever group he belongs to). In PUA culture it seems to mean something like "lady magnet who punches people in the mouth if they disagree with him, then laughs." Which is kind of an amusing transformation of a word from its original meaning to something completely different. My thoughts on "alpha" are here:

Anyway, most women don't go as crazy for "alphas" (as in, the leader of the group) as the PUA community seems to think they do. Very often, the guy who's the alpha is stuck commanding and entertaining the group while other people go hook up. And usually, because he is watched so closely within the group, the alpha male ends up paired up with
the alpha female, and because he can do no better than her within the group, and because he loses much of his value by moving outside of the group, there he is stuck.

Attraction is somewhat in one's control, mostly down to fundamentals. Most of your work on attraction is done before you even show up: if you show up in your crummiest, dumpiest clothes, hair disheveled, and looking dirty and unkempt, a certain percentage of women will like you regardless, and you will notice that the attraction they have for you is very STRONG, because you've effectively screened out any woman who is anything but hard attracted to you. The better your fundamentals, the wider you can cast the net, it's always going to include that core group of women who will be strongly attracted to you no matter what you look like, plus some that are more attracted to you because you look better. And then there's a swath of women who just won't want you no matter what you do. You could be Brad Pitt driving a Lamborghini with all the attraction switches firing on all cylinders, and a girl will tell herself that logically she should probably get with you, but she just isn't feeling it emotionally and ultimately decides against you.

I actually explored scent and the research on it quite a bit here: "Having a Male Scent That Fills Women with Lust." Additionally, I've seen a fair bit of research on different animals finding attractive the scents of other animals that have sufficiently variable immune genes from them - this seems to be the underlying thing pheromones communicate about organisms. It's unclear whether this happens in humans too, but the research seems to lean toward 'yes', and I've seen enough weird / unexplainable things with attraction that I think there's some invisible factor that lies outside our domain of control too.

I talked about the effect the birth control pill has on mate selection in this article: "What's the Best Way to Pick Up Girls? Get the Ones Looking for You"; essentially, it seems to dampen women's desire for high testosterone men, so that they enter into relationships with softer men, only to find once they stop taking the pill that they sour on these partners and begin to long for someone with higher testosterone levels.

Essentially, I'd differentiate between "love at first sight" attraction, which I think is probably some kind of "perfect immune gene match" mixed with a few other triggers, like her being fertile and recognizing that you're a good candidate for providing insemination, vs. the "this guy seems like a good choice for X" attraction, which is where she isn't crazy about you, but she's intrigued or curious or whatnot, so decides why not and sleeps with or dates you anyway.

Fundamentals help more with the latter; more broadening the net. The base / core attraction seems to be there regardless; I probably got as much of it when I had a beer belly, a fat face, a $10 haircut, and two-sizes-too-big clothing as I do now (although I also felt a lot less capable and less confident, and never closed out on any of that interest).

Tough women picking soft men - you'll frequently find that the most empowered women tend to prefer softer men because they are easier to control. I questioned both a naturally pretty dominant ex-girlfriend and a similarly dominant female friend about their mate choices - after breaking up with me, my ex dated a string of weak men; and my female friend dated almost entirely weaker men. Their responses were both the same: they feared that a more ambitious man would forget about them, or put them to the side while he kept another woman as his #1, and be too caught up in chasing down his dreams to give them the attention they craved.

These girls still enjoy sleeping with more dominant men - but they're smart girls, and they know they won't be in control or have the kind of relationship they aspire to with a man like that, so when it's settle-down-time they pick a man they won't have to worry about having cheat on them or marginalize them - and who will instead remain faithful, loyal, and devoted, even as they fly to conferences across the country and take other lovers... I've had women like this, and I've talked to more; George Clooney's fling in Up In the Air is a great example of this sort of woman; Roxie Hart's attitude toward her husband in Chicago is another. She's high-flying, going places, and doesn't want to limit her sexual freedoms too much, but she's like a soft guy at home holding down the fort and waiting for her with open arms, happy to see her when she gets back.

Chase

V's picture

Texting a girl weeks later


Hey Chase, I have some numbers in my phone that I never hit up. Some of them I forgot I had, some of them have my number as well and never texted me first, so I didn't text thinking she wasn't interested.

Do you think the girls un interested if she has your number and doesn't text you at all?

What do you text a girl you never texted before?

In my situation I got a girls number very fast. I just asked for it, she gave me her phone and I called my phone getting her number. It's been a few weeks and I forgot about her since ive been trying to pick up more girls. Then I thought "why not", I could get it.

Anyway, I asked for her number, we exchanged names and we haven't texted each other.
Should I even bother and if so what should I text?

Thank you!

J $'s picture

How to lie correctly


Im a horrible liar and in some situations I have to lie. But im an honest person and I crack when I tell lies or try to at least.
How do I lie and convince people that im telling the truth and how do I not crack and keep my lie strong?

I've been hearing dudes saying they lost their virginity at 6-12 years old. You think their lying? I feel less of a man hearing this since I started years after 12. How can I not feel less of a man and not care about this?
Thank you chase.

Chase Amante's picture

Re: How to lie correctly

Author

J$-

Well, if you want to be better at passing off some little white lies, first focus on learning the giveaways for this, and start erasing these tells from your own expressions and presentation in tense situations: "Tactics Tuesdays: Tell Someone Lying from Someone Who's Not."

As for men getting laid at very young ages... worry not. Once you are having sex fairly consistently, this won't bug you much; and if you reach the point where you outpace them in lay counts, it won't matter if you started at 13 or 30, because you'll still have slept with more women than they have.

Chase

Anonymous's picture

Is a girl supposed to know


Is a girl supposed to know you're flirting with her when you approach her? I.e. is your intent supposed to be understood or is the frame more like "I'm just being social... Oh, you're actually pretty interesting and sexy and now I'm attracted? This may differ depending on if youre initially attracted to a girl already based on her physical appearances right?

Chase Amante's picture

Showing Intent

Author

Anon-

I would recommend always telegraphing your interest when walking up - women know, and if you're framing it as "just being social", it looks like you are afraid of showing your interest, which is a major attraction buzz kill for a girl. See these articles on this:

Chase

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