One question that confuses the hell out of a lot of guys (and also confused the hell out of me when I first learned all this sexual Jedi mind power stuff) is how long to wait before calling (or texting) a girl… and how to move things forward towards a date and beyond once you do call her.
You may have heard that you should not be too eager, and you may even have heard about the three day rule… get in touch with her after three days.
Then again, that one is so common now that a text or call after three days doesn’t really surprise anyone anymore…
What’s a man to do?
And what about dates… how can you really sweep a woman off her feet anymore, or should you even be concerned with that question?
What if you don’t want to drink alcohol… and even if you do, can’t “drinks” be too stiff or formal?
What’s the right way to go?
How Long to Wait Before Calling
In response to the article about what to text girls:
“So after you got her number one random night, and then you send that text where you tell her to save the number, is there a time gap that you leave before sending the next text? I don't know where I got this, but between the first and second text of a new girl, I would leave a day between, then ask her out. So is it that I should do the first text, then the second with no wait (of course, SOME)?”
Great question… so how soon after you get her number should you text her? Right away, after a few hours, the same day, the next day or even after a few days?
The truth is that there are no real hard-and-fast rules here… but there ARE a couple of guidelines that are going to clear up some of the confusion:
The three-day rule only applies to social circle… if at all.
If you met her at a party where you both have a lot of mutual friends who introduced you to each other, calling the next day can sometimes be perceived as “coming on too strong”… in the context of a social circle, you have a lot more time to make things happen gradually, and it is also often wise to make ample use of plausible deniability (see: “How to Get Laid Every Time, Part II”).
We’ve discussed that women don’t appreciate gossip about whom they hook up with… well, if you both have friends in common that is doubly true. That doesn’t mean that you need to actually count to three… I’d rather follow a general guide line of not being too eager in that context, unless it was very “on”. But it does mean that if you want to get a girl alone later with you at some point whom you met through social circle, you want to set discretion frames.
If you pick up a girl you’d never met before, on the other hand, and that you don’t have any friends in common with, you should not wait long before you follow up. You need to strike the iron while it’s hot… otherwise you lose a lot of momentum. After a few days, “life happens”… depending on how long you talked to her, she may not even remember you that well, and even if she does, she’s no longer in the emotional state of being swept off her feet by a sexy stranger!
Verdict: Take it slower in social circle game, strike the iron while it’s hot after a cold approach.
Follow up very quickly in day game.
When I meet a girl during the day, I like to send her the first text on the same day I approached her. It’s a good way to keep the momentum going, and also to gauge how much she’s into you. I’ll often send her a text just a couple of minutes after we split, while she’s still on that little emotional high from my approach… it cements that positive emotion further and sets a little anchor where receiving text messages from me puts her back into that state. This won’t have a huge impact, but it’s still good to capitalize on the emotional spike you just created in her and text her before it has worn off.
After that first text, there are really two contingencies: if you hear back right away, text her again the next day and ask her what her schedule is like… this is the ideal way to nail down logistics for a meet-up because it saves you from chasing her through her calendar. If she ignores your first text or if she responds very late, on the other hand, don’t chase a lot. Just text again the next day, and if you don’t hear back a second time, let it go.
That’s right… I usually only follow up twice with girls if I don’t hear back. There is really no reason to send more texts… she has received the ones you did send, or if you called, she has seen your call. It’s not like back in the day when we had analogue phones and people would miss calls… in the age of the cell phone, a call or a text is never really missed, because it shows up on her display. If you really like her, you can send a third text after a couple of days just in case she genuinely forgot… but it’s a long shot, and your time is usually spent better elsewhere – review the article about making girls want you, and specifically the bit about “emptying the funnel.”
As an analogy… once you start having success in business, everything becomes an opportunity cost. Every hour, every dollar you spend on one deal, you can’t spend on another, and you have to make sure that you spend all your money and all your time only on the most promising, most high-value, and most profitable deals. Pursuing dating opportunities is no different – success is as much about knowing what to say no to and what to pass on as it is about following through on other things. Always remember the 80-20 rule and don’t sink a lot of time into “courting” girls who aren’t really into you.
Also keep in mind that you just don’t know what else is going on in her life. Maybe she just had a big fight with her boyfriend when you approached her, and that’s why she was excited to talk to you… but a couple of hours later they made up, and she’s now ignoring your texts. Nothing you did wrong. Put her on the list of unresponsive numbers, and once you have 100 of those, text them all at once and see if someone bites… you might get one or two of them after all. Usually the women who respond to this text are the ones who had merely been unresponsive previously because of circumstances that have since changed.
Finally, your goal is not to text girls, your goal is to meet them.
Every text I send is moving the interaction towards meeting up with her... and usually very quickly. Sometimes you might want to send texts that have nothing to do with a meet up at all, but only to set up the dynamic between you and her in a way where asking her out would be expected, and where she would accept the invitation. This is simple stuff… in fact, it could just be one text, but never more than a handful.
Verdict: If a girl spends a lot of time texting with you, this is a BAD sign, not a good one – if she really liked you, she’d just meet up.
Expectations and Coffee Dates
All right, so you’ve got her number, you know how long to wait before calling or texting, and you have followed up… and you’re starting to move things towards a meet up. But now what?
Again, the same confusion arises... you’ve probably read that dinner and a movie are a bad idea, but what about coffee dates? Or should you take her to a bar… on a party date… or something more exciting to really sweep her off her feet?
Here’s a question from a reader about this topic:
“The second question is that I am not a party guy and recently I decided not to take a drop of alcohol so it seems difficult for me the starting point or the starting line as I was always starting as: "when do you have time to get a beer or something you like, this coffee thing is very formal and to be honest it is not fun anymore?”
You know, the folks at Google have a sign up in their offices that reads like this:
I think that’s brilliant… because it gets to the essence of things:
You want to simplify, and then you want to simplify again, but without leaving out anything that’s essential. Simplicity is elegance… see the post on sprezzatura… and if you can make your seductions elegant, girls will only think one word:
And not in a bad way… not like a “smooth talker” or “agenda guy.” Rather, they will realize that you’re not making too much of an effort, and that everything is therefore happening effortlessly. There is nothing awkward going on, nobody is making any “move”… things just unfold, simply, elegantly, and naturally. Almost as if you and her were meant to be!
And the same rules also apply to dates… how’s this for a simple rule:
What you drink doesn’t matter.
You can have a coffee together and (subtly) talk about sex and it won’t be formal at all.
Or you can be at a bar together and drink beer but be stiff and stilted.
You could also meet her at a bar and have a non-alcoholic beverage… gasp! The drink you’re having is a complete non-factor.
The truth is that the only reason why you go to a bar or a café first is because you need to go someplace… and you want it to be a place without too many distractions, so that you can move the interaction forward, get to know each other better and eventually go home together.
You could really meet a girl pretty much anywhere; bars and cafés are simply comfortable and convenient… the actual drink has little to do with the date.
My Recommended Date
I have literally dated hundreds of women and I’ve tried just about everything you could think of. Early on I would take girls to romantic places because I figured that would be a great place for the first kiss. My “natural game” about 10 years ago basically consisted in chatting girls up with some indirect opener that I had come up with, then holding a conversation with them while being interesting and charismatic and finally isolating them. Once I had them alone, usually at a park or a beach or even in the back row of a movie theater, I would go for the kiss.
Taking girls on these kinds of elaborate dates as well as going for the kiss this early and in this way are things I don’t recommend anymore, and here is why:
That kind of date is overkill unless you want to get into a romantic relationship as opposed to a sexual one. Even then, I’d probably steer clear of anything that looks too much like courtship or like you and her have “something special” – this, too, violates the Law of Least Effort and it also violates the sexual frame. Even serious relationships are better when you start them off with a bang – you will hold a stronger position and the relationship will be more passionate.
As far as the kiss goes, I basically had to kiss girls on the date at some point because I hadn’t set any sexual or even romantic frame at all up to that moment. Sure, the girls probably knew why I had chatted them up, but I was only making conversation and being charming… I wasn’t really hitting on them. I instinctively knew that this was going to land me in the friend zone if I didn’t make a move at some point, so I simply went for the kiss. If you do make your intentions known, either with a direct opener or by framing the interaction as sexual, you won’t have that problem.
What you should do instead: again, I don’t kiss girls on the date at all anymore. It can certainly be done, but after extensive testing of kissing girls vs. not kissing them when we’re out together, I’ve found the latter is far better, for the following reasons:
Once you have kissed her, it’s harder to keep her chasing. She already knows you want her… and that can let the air out of the balloon of intrigue in a heartbeat. She will enjoy the kiss, but she will also feel validated in her desirability and in her feminine power, and she won’t be compelled to chase anymore. The next step after kissing is more physical intimacy, and most women aren’t in any rush to make that happen. The only way you could really pull that off was if you kissed her but always pulled back before she’s had enough of your kiss… that can compel her to keep reaching for more.
Even if you do that, however, you will find it harder to bounce girls back to your place once you have kissed them. Again – she knows what’s going to happen next… and you have therefore ruined all plausible deniability. If you haven’t even kissed her yet, if you’ve set a sexual frame yet stayed a bit ambiguous to keep her on her toes by sending her mixed signals, she has really no reason not to go back to your place… after all, you’re not even making moves on her. Once you’ve kissed her, though, that is no longer the case.
Finally, a great deal of what creates the right energy between you and her as you’re flirting is sexual tension. That is one reason why I recommend not playing the clown on dates (see: “Making a Girl Laugh Means NOTHING”)… laughter releases tension. There is another thing that releases tension, however… and that is a kiss. If you imagine the evening as the plotline of a story or a theater play, the entire evening is building the tension towards the climax… the hero and the heroine eventually getting together. Another balloon you can pop by kissing her too early… it’s like letting everyone know that the gardener killed the bride in one of the first few chapters.
What you should do instead: these days, I simply tell girls to meet up downtown for a drink in the early evening. We might go to a bar together or to a coffee shop… we might have a beer, a hot chocolate or a cocktail… that doesn’t matter. What matters is that no one is making a big thing out of the evening… it’s simply a guy and a girl who like each other, getting to know one another a bit better before going home to have sex.
In summation, always keep things simple. Don’t overcomplicate texting, don’t overcomplicate the date and don’t overcomplicate kissing her.
In simple steps:
As you go out, collect numbers, or even better, set dates with the women you meet and only take the number to confirm the meet-up later.
Text them soon after you first get to know them, especially if it was a cold-approach… don’t let the numbers go cold, and strike the iron while it’s hot.
As you are texting her, move things towards another meet up as soon as possible, by simply asking her about her schedule.
Make the date something simple… have a drink somewhere, and don’t overthink which kind of drink to have… it’s just a social excuse for the two of you to meet up.
Don’t kiss her on the date… instead, bounce her home at some point (see: “12 Simple Tips That’ll Help You Sleep with Girls”), and kiss her once you’re already in your bedroom together where you can take it all the way.
And this is how it’s done…
Move your mouse to the bottom left corner of your screen, click that silly blue circle and the hit the words “Shut Down.”
Put on some nice shoes and some cologne and give a girl some screaming multiple squirting orgasms… she’s probably had a hard day at work and is going to appreciate it.
Onward and upward,